New Nissan Pathfinder yay or nay?
- Thread starter 17triton
- Start date
Lots of smart people on here. Not at Nissan it seems!
Nay for me looks like a soft roader and has lost all street appeal.
Even regretting my R51 purchase in some ways.
@stuartcarr2002 has a soft spot for it and wants one already!
I went to Melbourne yesterday for a drive day for New Pathy, Juke and Altima. We drove the Territory, Kluger and Santa Fe. The New pathy shits over all them with refinement, road noise, power and features. The quality is leap and bounds ahead of R51 and based off the fuel figures it used stuff all more than my R51, and this was 7 press Pathy that have been driven hard. It has a tow button which changes the way the CVT reacts to inclines, and throttle position to give better fuel consumption and use of the engines torque. The CVT has been designed specifically for the R52 with towing in mind. Having driven plenty of Muranos, same engine, the performance and response is a lot better in the R52 and it is a heavier car. I will keep my R51 for at least another year and then look at updating.
If off roading is your thing then this isnt the car, but as i dont use the pathy off road much any more, SWMBO's Jimny is my toy for playing in the hard stuff, this Pathy may suit.
For those who knock it, drive it first, you will be very surprised.
Quite the opposite, The medium off road wagon market is shrinking. This is Vfacts not Nissan figures. The Market that is growing very quickly is the cross over medium size market. Look at Kluger, CX9 and Territory sales. They are booming. Nissan want a slice of a growing market, not a shrinking market. They are a business to make money. There words yesterday, if we loose 1 customer that wants an off road diesel, they will gain 4 customers that want a cross over (soccer mums etc).
And this is 100% the reason why I wouldn't want one.
The Pathfinder for a long time has been an off road vehicle that suited the market at a mid point price and to simply walk away from this shows me that the company is only after one thing and that is $$$.
Don't get me wrong, I understand $$$ is where it is all at and what keeps companies going but to simply drop the diesel market and the R51 all together shows a companies true colours.
To be honest I expect more from a company, I have been a long time fan of the Pathfinder progressing from an R50 to an R51 and this move is a money grab / market share grab and they have lost me as a customer purely because of the money grab aspect.
It really wouldn't have been that difficult to keep the R51 going for a few more years but introduce the 550 motor as a more standard product and keep both options open depending on your needs but produce less of the R51 if its not as popular.
Understand markets change but next 4WD will be something that a company is standing behind in terms of long term development as a capable towing and off road rig.
Def a shopping trolley! I had a good look at one last week. No diesel and def in the kluger / Territory range.
Its a nay from me!
Its a nay from me!
So is the Navara going down the Mazda styling line as well?
I am no marketing expert but a growing segment is the Twin Cab style ute market. Manufacturers also seem to be also offering 7 seaters designed off the Twin Cab platforms. To me it seems Nissan are taking a gamble and dropping this market which to me seems to be growing. Ie: Ford Everest, Colorado 7 etc, pretty much similar modern version of old Pathfinders. If that's what Nissan want to do then maybe the "Pathfinder" name should not be used on a car that to me is not a Pathfinder. If I said to my wife, "lets look at a CX9, Captiva, Territory, Santa Fe and a Pathfinder" , I know her response will be not a Pathfinder, that's a ute thing (her words). To me it looks like they are joining the CX9 party too late. They will sell some, but not probably to their old customers who need a Pathfinder for the space and towing features. A bit like a Kluger, great car but not the best for towing a van only due to limited tow capacity (I owned one, that's why we went BT50). I am sure it is more refined, but you know what, it should its a brand new designed car.
Japanese marketing: Give them what we want, not want they need.
Geoff
I am no marketing expert but a growing segment is the Twin Cab style ute market. Manufacturers also seem to be also offering 7 seaters designed off the Twin Cab platforms. To me it seems Nissan are taking a gamble and dropping this market which to me seems to be growing. Ie: Ford Everest, Colorado 7 etc, pretty much similar modern version of old Pathfinders. If that's what Nissan want to do then maybe the "Pathfinder" name should not be used on a car that to me is not a Pathfinder. If I said to my wife, "lets look at a CX9, Captiva, Territory, Santa Fe and a Pathfinder" , I know her response will be not a Pathfinder, that's a ute thing (her words). To me it looks like they are joining the CX9 party too late. They will sell some, but not probably to their old customers who need a Pathfinder for the space and towing features. A bit like a Kluger, great car but not the best for towing a van only due to limited tow capacity (I owned one, that's why we went BT50). I am sure it is more refined, but you know what, it should its a brand new designed car.
Japanese marketing: Give them what we want, not want they need.
Geoff
I can understand them wanting a slice of the pie but are they too late @stuartcarr2002? Most people associate a pathfinder as a very solid capable offroader-tow vehicle which is not what the new model resembles to me.
If they didnt focus on the $$$ they would end up back in the same spot they where before Renault took over. Bankrupt
I agree having the R51 run along side the R52 as they do in the Patrol and Navara, but it isnt gunna happen.
It isnt a money grab as you put it. The cost to develop a car is near a billion dollars. (Look at the commodore). Why would Nissan develop a car for our market when the world doesn't want it, only OZ. Our market is way too small and the return on investment wouldn't happen. This is why there isnt a Y62 diesel.
Nissan's theory is if you want to tow and want to go off road, by the y61 or D40...
New D40 is out next year. This is the other market people are going to, away from the off road wagons.
How many times do you here people say, i traded a Playdo, Pathy, Pajunk etc on a new duel cab. Heaps.
You only have to look at this forum to how many are buying the BT fugly and coming from wagons...
As i said the medium wagon market is shrinking. Cross over and d/cab is growing.
Nissan already has the Dualis (and +2), Murano, Xtrail. Two of those are AWD. All come as 2WD. What market are they wanting a slice of they they don't already have a reasonable stake in?
The new Pathfinder is still being touted as a 4x4. (although it too comes in 2wd) but even you say if you want to take it off road its not the best car for that. So why bother with the 4x4 driveline, other than they are still trying to capitalise on the off-road name that Pathfinder has had for almost 20 years.
Nissan has declining sales for a long time. In the 4x4 market, Navaras have come in number 2 for 5 years, behind Hilux. But if we take the utes out of the picture, Prado has averaged 14000 sales each year, LCrusiers (exc pickups) around 9500 sales, compared to pathys at
2000, and Patrols at 3000. (Vfacts) Last year Patrol was outsold by Great Wall v200 (yes, a ute used for, but still....Great Wall????
)So far, this year to Sept the Patrol is at no 9 for wagons (My lovely little D4 is at No 10 BTW
) A merc G-class at 2x the cost of a Y62 and 3x than a GU is only a few sales more than Patrol....One of the considerations I had when I sold my Pathy (albeit minor) was the announcement of the new Pathy. I wondered if it was possible that buyers seeing a R52 and considering it as soft, might by association paint the R51/50/W21 with the same brush. :noidea:
So after all that prattle, Nissan has a strong 4x4 history, but as Crackacoldie suggests, they have lost their way a bit. Killing off another real 4x4, delaying the diesel in the Y62, and GU so old in the tooth won't improve their reputation, IMHO
Why would they be too late. It is a growing market, not stagment.
THey are still selling near 1000 klugers a month. Territory isnt far behind. CX9 reaches 2-300 monthly.
Kluger often outsells Playdo. There is still plenty of pie to be eaten.
I do a lot of new car quoting for fleet, I have quoted more new Pathy this last few weeks than I have with old pathy for the last few months. It is out there and people are looking...