Electrical Jayco Standard Electrics

[aspiremr]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your reply. Really appreciate the information.

The fridge is a Waeco RPD175 compressor fridge. The manual tells me the average power consumption is 65 watts. So I think that means about 5 to 6 amps per hour. I haven't actually measured it, just going on what I have been told by people who seem to know more than I do and the manual. Two days away in the van, say 48 hours, means approx 250 amps going out. Solar panels in winter putting some back in, and I'm pretty sure I've been running them down way too low every time I use them.

Reading the manual for the Setec STIII and various opinions on the web, as well as a guy who works on these, and I think the battery charger in this unit is nowhere near robust enough to maintain 2 batteries adequately. But therein lies another issue, the guy who has given me the advice also sells and recommends all the replacement gear.

I really have not done any specific measuring as the van is not easily accessible day to day - it is stored about a 30 minute drive away from home. When I use it I typically pick it up after work on a Friday and head straight out, getting back home late on a Sunday. I am also really not good at technical stuff like this.

So that is also one of the attractions of installing a battery management system, apart from the compatibility in the future with lithium, it is supposedly easy to read and monitor what is happening with the batteries and the power being drawn. So while it is an expensive option, it solves so many issues - I get a proper battery charger; I get a good solar regulator; and I can understand what is going on and manage it accordingly. Happy to know if this is an expensive or silly way to do this or if there is a better way?

I have also thought similar to the way you suggest. Simply replace the batteries now, leave everything as is, and accept they will die early because i am drawing them down too far and not re-charging them properly. Or even turn the battery bank off when i take it back to storage and plug in an external stand alone battery charger, so at least the batteries are being charged properly in between uses.

I am interested in the price of batteries you quote. I have priced 120 Ah Full River batteries, which seem to be highly regarded, and they are approx $400 each. So spend $800, and what should last 5 years only last 2.5 years, so i am spending an extra $800 every 5 years. I would have to do that 5 times to have spent the same as upgrading the system. You say two batteries are $400 - is that each or for two? If that is for two, what am I missing?

My problem with the idea of just leaving it as is and turning over the batteries quicker is I hate running a system that is not really up to the task I am asking of it. And there will be times when i want to be away longer than 2 days. I don't want to always be worried about when the system is going to let me down. Had a camper trailer 12 volt system let me down on a remote beach hours from civilisation, fridge and freezer died and most of my vacuum sealed food defrosted days into a 7 week trip - think it scarred me for life. Was promised I didn't need a generator - if only!!

So while it may make sense in a dollars and cents way, it just doesn't sit well with me. I really want to have the system robust and working as it should, with batteries not running below 50% discharge, and solar putting in what I take out each day. And with a system that allows me to monitor what is happening easily, and plug in when i get home late on a sunday after being out without having to think about or manually configure anything.

And maybe most importantly, not have a low voltage alarm that goes off at 2 am and cannot be overridden.

Really appreciate all the input, thank Mike and Drover and everyone else. Really happy to have any additional suggestions or things I should do prior to coughing up the big dollars.

 

[mikerezny]

Hi @aspiremr,
you have a really interesting problem.

If you google "105Ah Gel battery" there are many sites selling these batteries for around $200. Some may be close enough to where you live to visit and sus them out. 105aH is a sweet spot with regard to pricing. It seems like there is a premium for the larger capacity 125Ah batteries.

I understand your desire to buy and forget. But taking the time to look at what you currently have, consider all the options, and asking here for independent advice will certainly result in you making a more informed decision.

An average 5-6 A per hour will be under test conditions. In winter, it should be significantly less, in summer, somewhat more.

National Luna fridges show much more detailed specs for their fridges:
Part No: NLR125S
Model: 125Lt National Luna - Stainless Steel
Battery Consumption:
53.52 amp/hour 24hr total.
Average amp/hour consumption is measured with a setting of -10oC over 24hrs in ambient temperatures 21°C x 12hrs (overnight), 32°C x 7hrs (morning/evening) and 43°C x 5hrs (midday/afternoon).
It is a shame that the other manufacturers can't provide something similar.

If you put one of the power monitors in line with the fridge you will be able to easily determine how much the fridge used in each of your 48 hour trips. It is quite a small cost and does not really increase the complexity.
It might be worth doing that asap so you are better informed about your power consumption which is critical in how you approach what is needed to supply it before you commit to an upgrade.
Here is a link to the one I bought. It costs $12.05 and ships from Darwin and took about a week to arrive:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/100A-60V...r-GT-/201416239397?hash=item2ee557e925&_uhb=1

Which model Setec III do you have? The Setec 20 will charge a battery at a maximum of 10A and the Setec 35, a maximum of 15A.
However, note that if the battery has been discharged too much (<10V) it will only float charge at 0.8A until the battery voltage gets above 10.5V or 11.5V. The little gadget above displays battery voltage.

Since you already have a generator, is it feasible to get a decent battery charger so that you could switch the fridge to mains and charge the batteries at about 30A each day. For example, 3 hours would deliver 3h x (6A + 30A) = 108Ah and then add a bit from your existing solar should mean you recover the batteries each day since you need around 125Ah per day, assuming your fridge averages 6A.

The main problem here is similar to one my friend who lives off grid has in winter. Most chargers rarely deliver maximum charge for very long. They seem to taper off as the battery voltage increases. This is ok if you are on mains since there is time to spare and you only pay for the watts you consume. However, when you are on generator, you want the charger to run flat out until the batteries get up to a high State of Charge so you can switch the generator off as soon as possible. He doesn't want to run a 3kW generator into a 30A battery charger that only wants to put 10A (about 130W) into the batteries after the first hour or so. His solution was to build his own charger that does exactly what he needs. Sorry, I'm digressing.

Now onto solar. I don't know which State you live in. But, in Victoria, solar in winter is problematic. Low sun means shadows from trees gets in the way. Short days. Mostly overcast. This is my first winter, but based on the past couple of months a couple of hours a day over 2-3 days would be the norm. To recover 125Ah per day in Victoria would mean 60A from the solar, which means about 700W.
This makes the generator option quite attractive, especially in winter.
It is not uncommon to read of vans with 2-way fridges needing a generator to keep the batteries charged during the winter months.

Please don't hit me. But..., 3-way fridges work really efficiently in winter and don't consume much gas. @Drover gets about 11days out of a 9kg bottle with a fridge which is similar in size to yours, if I am not mistaken. Cost of a refill is $20.

One point is that with your current option, you may still need to replace batteries every 5 years instead of 2.5 years, so it is still not exactly buy and forget. I wouldn't worry too much about setting up for Lithium. This is a fast moving area and no-one knows what will be around in 5 years time except that it will be way cheaper.

My wish list would that in 5 years time van fridges will be 20-50% more efficient, lithium batteries will be smaller, and solar panels will be more efficient. AND all three will be much cheaper and weigh less. Until then, I will carry on with the 3-way fridge, a 40W solar panel, a 105Ah battery and keep wishing and dreaming!

cheers
Mike

 

[Drover]

That gizmo @mikerezny I like the price, if I put it between my battery and my buss bar it would read everything going on with the battery, put an anderson on each end, then I could pull it off and use it elsewhere if needed or if it crapped out, no drama to plug battery back into the circuit....................might add it to the Mod list.

I have an old battery no good for starting but good enough to run 12v stuff in shed it sits outside with a 2w supercheap panel thats about 6 yrs old at least, was $20 on special and it's kept charged up, mind only runs the radio and some odd test light stuff, but in a previous life kept the ride on battery charged..

 

[mikerezny]

That gizmo @mikerezny I like the price, if I put it between my battery and my buss bar it would read everything going on with the battery, put an anderson on each end, then I could pull it off and use it elsewhere if needed or if it crapped out, no drama to plug battery back into the circuit....................might add it to the Mod list.

I have an old battery no good for starting but good enough to run 12v stuff in shed it sits outside with a 2w supercheap panel thats about 6 yrs old at least, was $20 on special and it's kept charged up, mind only runs the radio and some odd test light stuff, but in a previous life kept the ride on battery charged..

Hi @Drover,
I should mention that unfortunately this device only works in one direction. So you can use it to measure what comes out of the battery or what goes in, or you need two of them.

I have it between the solar regulator and the battery. I first plug it into the battery and the voltage reading gives me an indication of State of Charge (SOC), i.e. How much has been taken out since being last charged. Then I plug in the solar panel and that tells me how much current is going in at any time which is helpful for positioning the solar panel. The accumulation current and battery voltage is really useful seeing how much current is needed to get the battery back up over 14V. It is another way of determining what the SOC was at the beginning.

Although it would be useful, I don't need to know what current I am drawing. I only have LED lights which are on a dimmer and don't draw much and aren't on all that long, I guess less than 1Ah per day, a fridge fan which I know draws about 80mA, less than 2Ah. occasionally a small 12V fan in Summer, and occasionally a charger for the rechargeable batteries in lights and torches.
I have a couple of stick on LED lights that use 3 AAA batteries. Way cheaper and easier than running 12V wiring all over the place. I have one in the front boot and another just inside the external hatch on the side. They cost $1 from eBay. The rechargeable batteries are the really good Low Self Discharge ones from IKEA.

cheers
Mike

 

[Drover]

Yeah, once I looked into it more I realized that was the case, I was interested in the draw from the battery as my solar controller shows me in detail whats going in and the remote module for the Projecta gives me it's details, not that it gets used very much and when I think about it I wouldn't look at it very often so may as well just use my meter when the need arises, if I can find where I put the shunt for it.....................................the voltmeter inside is really all I need....................

 

[Drover]

Have had a re-read of this and I really think it's a wiring fault, I do agree with fitting a better charging system but thats not a biggy. I can see you problem when you can't get at the van, pity your not around my way, van parking in my yard and we would have it sorted in no time while everyone else goes to the beach.........Big Mal sits outside and solar keeps things charged up, charger gets used maybe once or twice a year if that............

 

[Boots in Action]

Hi again @aspiremr , you are certainly calling in a lot of expertise for your battery and charging system. Whilst @Drover, @mikerezny, @Dobbie and myself have supplied you with lots of scenarios, I am beginning to think there is more to it than the info we are working on. @Crusty181, I think is getting onto the problem with current draw being too much for your electrical system and @mikerezny has also spoken of measuring current draw from your refrigerator. 200 amps is not the way it should be calculated and in any case, and is way, way over anything it should be!!! Without KNOWING exactly what current you are using for your compressor fridge, it is hard to recommend how much power you need to generate or have storage capacity for. We need to know size (capacity) of fridge/freezer, and the technical details of same. I am assuming you are using a 12 volt compressor fridge, not a 240 volt fridge with an inverter to run it at 12 volts?? Is the fridge in any way faulty or have its cooling outlet restricted or something silly like that?? I am attaching a good simple explanation of current drain from a compressor fridge (similar to @mikerezny) produced by Australiandirect.com.au which may be helpful to you. Also the fact that you are unable to get much charge out of your solar panels owing poor weather conditions and lack of longer periods of sunlight is a real handicap. Your fridge should NOT draw the amount of current you calculated and should be cycling on and off as temperature setting is reached. In fact, even if drawing 8 amps per hour, on a 40% running cycle usage would only be 8 amps X 24 hours per day X 40% which would total around 77 amps, still a lot!!! Is your thermostat working properly or is the setting stuck and not switching the compressor off when temp reached?? More to think about , but more precise info needed too. We are all still hoping you can sort out this problem from afar!! Cheers.
PS. Have a look at my testing of solar panels which I should have on this forum by tomorrow evening and you will see just how much more you can get out of your solar panels with a good MPPT solar controller.

 

[aspiremr]

Hi Drover,

Just gotten back from a weekend away. Tried a few new things, which I'l add in to the comments below. But here are a couple of photos of the batteries. It does appear that that Positive from one battery goes to the negative of the other. And then the negative seems to run off to a shunt and then in to the van somewhere.

View media item 284

 

[Crusty181]

It does appear that that Positive from one battery goes to the negative of the other.

Not sure that's ideal

 

[aspiremr]

HI All,

Thanks so much for the continued interest and advice.

This weekend out I tried a few things. As i said in an earlier post I don't have easy access to the van at home, which does make it a bit harder.

Firstly, in the week prior to heading out I hooked the two batteries up to my external CTek battery charger. I turned the battery bank off at the Drifter control panel, hooked the charger up to positive on one of the batteries, and negative to the other battery. It was left hooked up for 7 days. The Ctek unit is a 15A charger that is supposedly suitable for anything from 30 A to 300 A, and suitable for lead acid batteries including Gel. (Ctek Multi XS 1500). So I hope that gave the batteries the best chance at being fully charged.

While out in the bush I made a point of observing what the Drifter unit was telling me, what the Solar regulator was telling me, and how the readings reacted to different things I did.

When I first arrived the Drifter told me I had 12.5 volts.

It seemed really strange all around.

It was pretty cold, maximum 12 to 13 degree, minimum 2 to 3 degrees.

In full sunlight in the middle of the day, completely unshaded, the solar regulator told me there was approx 7 amps of current coming in. Surely that is not enough for 2 by 150 watt panels? And I only had that for a couple of hours at most, the sun is so low in the sky and shaded by trees most of the day. So not a lot of re-charge happening, but I still think that's not enough current for those panels in the peak of the day.

When only an LED light was running inside, and the fridge had not been opened for some hours the Drifter told me I had 12.4 volts, and 60 or 70 hours useful battery life remaining. When I then plugged in my iPhone to the USB plug in the drifter panel, the voltage reading on the drifter panel dropped to 12.1 volts. Surely an iPhone cannot draw that much voltage immediately on plugging in. When I unplug my iPhone the volts returned to 12.4 volts. WT???

What I did notice was any time after opening the fridge to get something out, the hours of useful life left, according to the drifter panel, dropped substantially. From something in the order of 60 or 70 hours remaining, to 10 to 12 hours remaining. It also show amps being drawn from the drifter panel of circa 5 to 6. After a little while, say 20 minutes of the fridge not being accessed, the amps dropped back to down to 1 or less, and the hours remaining returned to 60 or 70.

It seems any time there is anything drawing on the battery, the Drifter panel showed the voltage in the batteries being much much less. Turn on half a dozen lights and the water pump and the display shows low voltage - circa 12 to 12.1. Turn everything off, and the Drifter panel shows voltage circa 12.4 or 12.5. Voltage in the batteries doesn't go up or down based on what is being drawn does it?

Again, all i have to read out and measure is the drifter panel, or the solar regulator. And I don't trust either of them.

But it does appear that the fridge being opened ramps up the drain on the battery massively.

The fridge power usage is shown in the manual as average of 65 watts, so with 12 volts that is approx 5.5 amps. I was assuming that an average took into account the cycling in and out - but maybe not?

So what I think I can conclude is in the middle of winter the batteries will manage the fridge because I access it only once to twice in the course of a day, and the ambient temperature is so cold anyway. But in warmer temperatures, like I had when the problems started earlier this year, the fridge is drawing much more heavily and the batteries don't have enough capacity.

You can see the appeal of the Battery Management System - an idiot proof system i can read and therefore understand what is going on, while simultaneously replacing the crappy solar regulator and installing a quality battery charger to replace the Setec ST-3 power supply.

However, I haven't spent any dollars yet, so what do you gent's suggest I check first prior to spending any significant dollars, and how would I go about it?

Really appreciate all the assistance.

 

[aspiremr]

Hi again @aspiremr , you are certainly calling in a lot of expertise for your battery and charging system. Whilst @Drover, @mikerezny, @Dobbie and myself have supplied you with lots of scenarios, I am beginning to think there is more to it than the info we are working on. @Crusty181, I think is getting onto the problem with current draw being too much for your electrical system and @mikerezny has also spoken of measuring current draw from your refrigerator. 200 amps is not the way it should be calculated and in any case, and is way, way over anything it should be!!! Without KNOWING exactly what current you are using for your compressor fridge, it is hard to recommend how much power you need to generate or have storage capacity for. We need to know size (capacity) of fridge/freezer, and the technical details of same. I am assuming you are using a 12 volt compressor fridge, not a 240 volt fridge with an inverter to run it at 12 volts?? Is the fridge in any way faulty or have its cooling outlet restricted or something silly like that?? I am attaching a good simple explanation of current drain from a compressor fridge (similar to @mikerezny) produced by Australiandirect.com.au which may be helpful to you. Also the fact that you are unable to get much charge out of your solar panels owing poor weather conditions and lack of longer periods of sunlight is a real handicap. Your fridge should NOT draw the amount of current you calculated and should be cycling on and off as temperature setting is reached. In fact, even if drawing 8 amps per hour, on a 40% running cycle usage would only be 8 amps X 24 hours per day X 40% which would total around 77 amps, still a lot!!! Is your thermostat working properly or is the setting stuck and not switching the compressor off when temp reached?? More to think about , but more precise info needed too. We are all still hoping you can sort out this problem from afar!! Cheers.
PS. Have a look at my testing of solar panels which I should have on this forum by tomorrow evening and you will see just how much more you can get out of your solar panels with a good MPPT solar controller.

Hi Boots,

The Fridge is a Waeco RDP175. It's a 175 Litre upright fridge freezer, 12v compressor only fridge. The manual says it uses 65 watts of power, doesn't give any detail on what cycle that is based on. 65 watts at 12 volts is approx 5.5 amps. But how often it cycles on and off would depend on the ambient conditions I would guess.

Does that help?

My thoughts were 24 hours at 5.5 amps is 132 amps. BY two days is 264 amps. Plus what ever else i use, which is minimal - a few LED lights, and water pump for washing etc. For some reason the solar does not seem to be putting much back in, but then it is winter and the sun is really low and shaded by trees for most of the day.

Thanks so much for the advice.

 

[aspiremr]

If they dropped like that on the bench without any load, disconnected from van and each other then I would say they have failed. While the Setek may not have given them a full charge it would have made no change and would be better than none. Your dual batteries should have been connected with Pos to Pos and Neg to Neg with the van Pos coming from one battery and the van Neg from the other this will ensure they both get an equal charge and draw down........The solar reg should be connected directly to the battery. Some have found that while their 12v/solar/charging worked the wiring of the 12v set up left a lot to be desired and was causing problems. Take the batteries to a proper battery shop for a check up but sounds like you may be shopping soon.

When I had one melt down a few years ago the Battery guru said it does happen and GEL/AGM will just fail for no apparent reason or will last for years..................Have a look at this site but be prepared with coffee as it can suck you in with a plethora of wonderful, informative articles.
http://caravanandmotorhomebooks.com/connecting-caravan-batteries/

Hi Drover,

Just re-reading all the threads, and you state that the batteries should be connected positive to positive and negative to negative. I don't think mine are that way. I'm pretty sure my batteries are positive to negative. Would that be a cause of problems?

I think this photo is easier to see, but still pretty difficult to make out details. Does it help?View media item 285

 

[Drover]

Not getting any image @aspiremr but in reply to your battery connection have a read of this article, it will explain things far better than me, it even has pictures which makes it easier..... http://caravanandmotorhomebooks.com/connecting-caravan-batteries/ there are also links to more info, I have found it put forward a very good description of the How and Why.....

I think you will find your wiring set up may be the cause of your problems.

 

[mikerezny]

HI All,

Thanks so much for the continued interest and advice.

This weekend out I tried a few things. As i said in an earlier post I don't have easy access to the van at home, which does make it a bit harder.

Firstly, in the week prior to heading out I hooked the two batteries up to my external CTek battery charger. I turned the battery bank off at the Drifter control panel, hooked the charger up to positive on one of the batteries, and negative to the other battery. It was left hooked up for 7 days. The Ctek unit is a 15A charger that is supposedly suitable for anything from 30 A to 300 A, and suitable for lead acid batteries including Gel. (Ctek Multi XS 1500). So I hope that gave the batteries the best chance at being fully charged.

While out in the bush I made a point of observing what the Drifter unit was telling me, what the Solar regulator was telling me, and how the readings reacted to different things I did.

When I first arrived the Drifter told me I had 12.5 volts.

It seemed really strange all around.

It was pretty cold, maximum 12 to 13 degree, minimum 2 to 3 degrees.

In full sunlight in the middle of the day, completely unshaded, the solar regulator told me there was approx 7 amps of current coming in. Surely that is not enough for 2 by 150 watt panels? And I only had that for a couple of hours at most, the sun is so low in the sky and shaded by trees most of the day. So not a lot of re-charge happening, but I still think that's not enough current for those panels in the peak of the day.

When only an LED light was running inside, and the fridge had not been opened for some hours the Drifter told me I had 12.4 volts, and 60 or 70 hours useful battery life remaining. When I then plugged in my iPhone to the USB plug in the drifter panel, the voltage reading on the drifter panel dropped to 12.1 volts. Surely an iPhone cannot draw that much voltage immediately on plugging in. When I unplug my iPhone the volts returned to 12.4 volts. WT???

What I did notice was any time after opening the fridge to get something out, the hours of useful life left, according to the drifter panel, dropped substantially. From something in the order of 60 or 70 hours remaining, to 10 to 12 hours remaining. It also show amps being drawn from the drifter panel of circa 5 to 6. After a little while, say 20 minutes of the fridge not being accessed, the amps dropped back to down to 1 or less, and the hours remaining returned to 60 or 70.

It seems any time there is anything drawing on the battery, the Drifter panel showed the voltage in the batteries being much much less. Turn on half a dozen lights and the water pump and the display shows low voltage - circa 12 to 12.1. Turn everything off, and the Drifter panel shows voltage circa 12.4 or 12.5. Voltage in the batteries doesn't go up or down based on what is being drawn does it?

Again, all i have to read out and measure is the drifter panel, or the solar regulator. And I don't trust either of them.

But it does appear that the fridge being opened ramps up the drain on the battery massively.

The fridge power usage is shown in the manual as average of 65 watts, so with 12 volts that is approx 5.5 amps. I was assuming that an average took into account the cycling in and out - but maybe not?

So what I think I can conclude is in the middle of winter the batteries will manage the fridge because I access it only once to twice in the course of a day, and the ambient temperature is so cold anyway. But in warmer temperatures, like I had when the problems started earlier this year, the fridge is drawing much more heavily and the batteries don't have enough capacity.

You can see the appeal of the Battery Management System - an idiot proof system i can read and therefore understand what is going on, while simultaneously replacing the crappy solar regulator and installing a quality battery charger to replace the Setec ST-3 power supply.

However, I haven't spent any dollars yet, so what do you gent's suggest I check first prior to spending any significant dollars, and how would I go about it?

Really appreciate all the assistance.

Hi @aspiremr,
there is something definitely strange with the battery voltages you are seeing. It could certainly be that the batteries have lost a lot of capacity, BUT that is not the only possibility.

What town do you live in?

First step is to get hold of a digital multimeter, either borrow or buy one. They are not expensive and you can get one from Jaycar or Altronics, even on eBay. It is also possible you have loose connection somewhere that is dropping the voltage.
Repeat some of the testing you have just completed, BUT, use the multimeter to measure the battery voltages on EACH of the batteries and compare them to what the panel is showing. Especially look at the case when the fridge is working and when it is not.

Another weird problem is what you are observing with using the USB connection on the drifter panel. It would appear that using the USB port is reducing the voltage on the drifter panel. Again, it might be worth using a multimeter to measure the voltage on the drifter panel. This is out of my experience, so someone familiar with a drifter panel might be able to give you more detail.

It seems like the fridge is drawing 5-6A only when it is running and the manual is incorrect in stating that 65W is the average. If so, this is good news since what you have observed is about what I would expect. This observation massively reduces the battery / solar installation you need.

There is also something strange happening with your solar panels. In good sunlight you should be getting much more out of 2 x 150 Watt panels. Are the two panels on the roof? If so, have you checked that they are both clean? How are they wired. Are they daisy chained on the roof before going down to the solar regulator? I assume that the regulator is mounted near the batteries?
Now, 300W at 15V is 20A. That would need some reasonably thick cabling from the solar panels to the regulator and from the regulator to the batteries to work correctly.

By the way, I cannot download or view your picture of the battery setrup.

cheers
Mike

 

[Bellbirdweb]

Hi Drover,

Just re-reading all the threads, and you state that the batteries should be connected positive to positive and negative to negative. I don't think mine are that way. I'm pretty sure my batteries are positive to negative. Would that be a cause of problems?

I think this photo is easier to see, but still pretty difficult to make out details. Does it help?View media item 285

The negative wire on the 1st battery pic is tiny.

If that's all that is linking the 2 batteries in parallel then there is definatley not sufficient current going to that battery.

 

[mikerezny]

Hi Drover,

Just re-reading all the threads, and you state that the batteries should be connected positive to positive and negative to negative. I don't think mine are that way. I'm pretty sure my batteries are positive to negative. Would that be a cause of problems?

I think this photo is easier to see, but still pretty difficult to make out details. Does it help?View media item 285

Hi @aspiremr,
the red and black wires going from the left-hand battery should be connected directly to the right-hand battery. They should be much heavier than the existing tiny wires. There is no need for the in-line fuse on top of the left-hand battery. In fact, it would be worth checking that the fuse is not blown. These two wires should be connected: RED connecting the +ve terminals of both batteries, and BLACK connecting the -ve terminals of both batteries.

I would suggest that these existing two wires should replaced by cable about the same size as the thick black cable going from the -ve terminal of the left-hand battery to the drifter shunt. The shunt is a very small resistor and the current that flows through it produces a small voltage drop which is used by the drifter panel to display the current into and out of the battery (or batteries).

cheers
Mike

 

[Boots in Action]

Hi Drover,

Just re-reading all the threads, and you state that the batteries should be connected positive to positive and negative to negative. I don't think mine are that way. I'm pretty sure my batteries are positive to negative. Would that be a cause of problems?

I think this photo is easier to see, but still pretty difficult to make out details. Does it help?View media item 285

Hi @aspiremr , I think we are starting to get somewhere now. If you have any main battery wire joining a positive on one battery to a negative on another, then the batteries are connected in SERIES!! That will give you 24 volts across the positive and negative terminals that are NOT connected to battery posts. One wire will probably go to the SETEC and the other wire will go to the shunt and then to earth point (negative polarity).
When batteries are connected in SERIES with 24 volts possibly in system, the following WILL HAPPEN:
1. Your fridge will work okay as a lot of compressor fridges will work just as good (or even better) with the higher voltage. There may also be a switch on fridge to select 24 or 12 volt, but for a lot of them, it is automatic as voltage is "sensed". Current draw at 24 volts is now half of what it would be at 12 volts!!
2. Your solar controller is also probably charging at 24 plus volts as most of the controllers are also "auto sensing" for voltage operation, so that should be okay too.
3. The BIG,BIG problem is your normal charging system. As far as I know, the Setec charger is only for charging 12 volt systems and would NEVER be able to fully charge the 24 volt battery bank you have. I think it has a charging voltage cut off at 13.05 volts and so NEVER charges your batteries at all. In fact it is amazing that it still operates . Definitely worth a look at exactly what type of Setec unit you have. If NOT marked as a 24 volt charger/distribution system, then you have found your problem. If the battery/electrical system set is for (24 volts???), you will need to get a charger which can charge a 24 volt battery bank. Also, the output on your generator would also need to be set at 24 volts - NOT 12 volts.
But BEFORE DOING THAT, MAKE SURE that the batteries are in fact connected positive to negative with a single wire and that the two remaining wires one POSITIVE and one NEGATIVE coming from the other battery posts are connected to other points in circuit. If you put 24 volts through a 12 volt system, there will be a lot of smoke and burning - something you do not want. If you put 12 volts into a 24 volt system, there probably will not be any damage - just very poor performance!!! The picture is not clear as to where the positive (red) wire on the left battery goes although it appears to be connected to another red wire. Follow that red wire carefully and CONFIRM where it is connected to. Perhaps send another picture when we can see where the other red wire is connected. Take @mikerezny advice and get yourself a good multimeter and if necessary, a knowledgeable friend who knows how to use it properly - if you don't.
When battery voltage drops off when ever there is any sort of load placed on circuit, it indicates that the battery has voltage only and has no capacity to deliver current. The Setec charger will stop charging (going to float only) if the voltage is reached but is not "smart" enough to know that the battery is not holding its proper full capacity to deliver CURRENT. Probably caused by batteries never being fully charged after each time used!!
I look forward to receiving better pictures to help clarify what is really going on. Cheers

 

[mikerezny]

In full sunlight in the middle of the day, completely unshaded, the solar regulator told me there was approx 7 amps of current coming in. Surely that is not enough for 2 by 150 watt panels? And I only had that for a couple of hours at most, the sun is so low in the sky and shaded by trees most of the day. So not a lot of re-charge happening, but I still think that's not enough current for those panels in the peak of the day.

Hi @aspiremr,
7A is what I would expect from ONE 150W panel in winter with the panel not pointing straight at the sun. I would strongly suspect that something is wrong with one of the panels. I would suggest first climbing up and inspecting both panels to ensure that they are both clean. Then, when you have the van in the sun again, check the charging rate, then climb up and throw a blanket over each panel, one at a time to check that they are both contributing to the charging rate.

good luck
Mike

 

[aspiremr]

Morning All,
Thanks for all the replies. You guys all lie too far away or I'd owe you all beers.

Ok, so first things first, I will go next weekend and look really closely at the cabling. Should be positive to positive and negative to negative, and needs a much heavier cable connecting the two batteries.

I'm sure i can do that, go to a electric store, buy some cable and some connectors.

Once I've done that, then I will see how it performs.

I do have a multi-meter, so will also take the time to check what voltage the batteries have according to the drifter panel versus my multi meter, from the drifter with things plugged in and also not plugged in

And I'll try to get some better pictures of the battery setup - took these ones in a hurry on the way to a weekend ride, so it was already late when i took them on the way out, and as usual i got home late Sunday. Next weekend I'l be go to the van and spend a heap of time testing and checking and taking photos etc.

Can anyone suggest to me how can i test what is happening with the solar panels - do I get up on the roof in sun with the multimeter and check what voltage/current is coming from the wires that come out of each individual panel? Or do they need to be taken off the roof and taken to someone to test?

 

[mikerezny]

Can anyone suggest to me how can i test what is happening with the solar panels - do I get up on the roof in sun with the multimeter and check what voltage/current is coming from the wires that come out of each individual panel? Or do they need to be taken off the roof and taken to someone to test?

Hi @aspiremr,
I think I made a suggestion in a previous post that will give a good indication for further investigation.

When you take some more pictures, it would be good to also clearly see what cabling is going into and out of the solar controller.

cheers
Mike