Just Browsing First time owner I have questions

[Troy Foz]

Hi All,
Only just signed up and I have recently purchased a 2005 Jayco Expanda for me and my family the van has 2 x 4.5 liter gas bottles on the front and I'm wondering how long would you think we could run the fridge on these as I have a 150 lt 3 way fridge.
Also we were away on the weekend the fridge was running on 240 v but accidentally the door was left open for a estimate of 3-4 hours so naturally the fridge went warm once closed it took another 24 to even start going cold again, is this normal as the fridge and freezer are running fine now.

Any assistance is appreciated.

Cheers

 

[mikerezny]

Hi All,
Only just signed up and I have recently purchased a 2005 Jayco Expanda for me and my family the van has 2 x 4.5 liter gas bottles on the front and I'm wondering how long would you think we could run the fridge on these as I have a 150 lt 3 way fridge.
Also we were away on the weekend the fridge was running on 240 v but accidentally the door was left open for a estimate of 3-4 hours so naturally the fridge went warm once closed it took another 24 to even start going cold again, is this normal as the fridge and freezer are running fine now.

Any assistance is appreciated.

Cheers

Hi Troy,
welcome aboard!

Are you sure they are 4.5kg gas cylinders?

To give you some idea, We have a Penguin with a 95l Dometic 3-way fridge, RM2350. We get between 20 - 28 days out of a 9kg gas cylinder. A 150l fridge will use a bit more gas.
The recovery time for a 3-way fridge is very slow. They don't have the spare cooling capacity that a compressor fridge.
I would not be surprised to find it took 24 hours to recover.
There are lots of tricks to get good to acceptable performance from these fridges. When you are ready, do a search on this forum, this topic has had lots of discussion.
Even with all the tricks, they will tend to struggle in temperatures above 40C.

cheers
Mike

 

[Boots in Action]

Hi All,
Only just signed up and I have recently purchased a 2005 Jayco Expanda for me and my family the van has 2 x 4.5 liter gas bottles on the front and I'm wondering how long would you think we could run the fridge on these as I have a 150 lt 3 way fridge.
Also we were away on the weekend the fridge was running on 240 v but accidentally the door was left open for a estimate of 3-4 hours so naturally the fridge went warm once closed it took another 24 to even start going cold again, is this normal as the fridge and freezer are running fine now.

Any assistance is appreciated.

Cheers

Hello @Troy Foz and welcome to the forum. I too have a Penguin like @mikerezny and a single 9 kg gas cylinder with gauge in line for my Thetford 92 litre fridge - much smaller than yours. However, we use our gas to cook with and also run our fridge. As we go away off grid for a week most times, we find that our single 9kg gas bottle lasts at least two trips away or approx 14 days. If you are using the gas for cooking also, I think you would be looking at 10 to 12 days, so make sure your second bottle is always full so you can change over when necessary. If both are connected at the same time, this would not apply, but I like the idea of using just one at a time and switching to reserve when one runs out. But make sure you do not delay in filling empty cylinder. I have a second 4kg bottle connected to a two way tap, so I can switch over at any time if I run out expectantly, and can then expect to have that smaller cylinder last about a week.
As @mikerezny explained above, your 3 way fridge is an "ABSORPTION" type and is slow to pull down the temperature inside the fridge and contents compared to a "COMPRESSOR" fridge which uses 12/24 volt battery power to operate rather than gas. Both can operate on 240 volts but the Absorption is still a lot slower to pull down the temperature.

 

[Drover]

Welcome to the mob @Troy Foz as the others have said you will find some good write ups on how to check and improve your fridge operation........My rig has an 187lt fridge and an 8.5kg bottle will last 8 -11 days, that depends on how often the stove and HWS is used, I work n a bottle every 7 days when camping. (free camp)
On the label inside the door of your fridge it will show how many MJ per hr your fridge burns, divided that by the capacity of your gas bottle ( 8.5kg = 441MJ ) what they call a 4.5kg bottle actually only holds 3.7kgs of gas so has 181MJ .
The ELGAS web site has heaps of info.
If you are aiming at doing mostly free camping I would be looking at getting rid of the 4kg bottles and refitting with 8.5kg as the refill/swap for the small bottles are expensive when compared to 8.5 bottles, if weight is a problem then just go one but for free camping 2 bottles is really a wise choice.

 

[Troy Foz]

Welcome to the mob @Troy Foz as the others have said you will find some good write ups on how to check and improve your fridge operation........My rig has an 187lt fridge and an 8.5kg bottle will last 8 -11 days, that depends on how often the stove and HWS is used, I work n a bottle every 7 days when camping. (free camp)
On the label inside the door of your fridge it will show how many MJ per hr your fridge burns, divided that by the capacity of your gas bottle ( 8.5kg = 441MJ ) what they call a 4.5kg bottle actually only holds 3.7kgs of gas so has 181MJ .
The ELGAS web site has heaps of info.
If you are aiming at doing mostly free camping I would be looking at getting rid of the 4kg bottles and refitting with 8.5kg as the refill/swap for the small bottles are expensive when compared to 8.5 bottles, if weight is a problem then just go one but for free camping 2 bottles is really a wise choice.

Thanks for the info @Drover,

based on the figure that you supplied for a 3.7kg bottle with my fridge running at 1.41 MJ/Hr ill get 158 hours just for the fridge (6.61 days) obviously I would like to change over to a single 9 kg bottle purely out of cost and convenience of change over but that would take some redesigning.
only new to the caravan game so still so much to learn but cheers for the assistance.

 

[1DayIll]

I have the 2008 Expanda and it has the same gas bottles on the front. I was always told it would do the fridge for about 7 days so calculation sounds about right. I find my fridge does get colder quicker on the gas than plugged in but might be just dreaming about this!
Welcome as well!

 

[Troy Foz]

Im now looking at the two holders on the from and might replace one with a 9kg holder so then have a 3.7kg spare with a 9kg.

 

[Boots in Action]

Im now looking at the two holders on the from and might replace one with a 9kg holder so then have a 3.7kg spare with a 9kg.

Great idea there @Troy Foz . As @Drover said, wise to have a back up if possible, but as he warned, watch the weight on front draw bar. If you want to save yourself the hassle of changing over cylinders, (it is sure to run out at night or when it is pouring rain!!!), a twin connector with a directional tap is the go. Not all that expensive but depends on your priorities and financial situation. Me, I don't like mucking around in the dark or rain with a spanner connecting/disconnecting gas lines!! Good luck with your van!

 

[icetechaus]

You need to make sure that you can still get the spare tyre out when you put the bigger bottle on.

 

[Troy Foz]

I've since measured all up for the bigger bottle and the folding bed wont allow it to sit in the existing mount so i have had to put it on the back burner.
@Boots in Action yea I have 2 x 3.7 kg bottles with a directional tap already installed on the van so looks like ill just have to make sure I have full bottles while I'm doing unpowered camping.

 

[Boots in Action]

I've since measured all up for the bigger bottle and the folding bed wont allow it to sit in the existing mount so i have had to put it on the back burner.
@Boots in Action yea I have 2 x 3.7 kg bottles with a directional tap already installed on the van so looks like ill just have to make sure I have full bottles while I'm doing unpowered camping.

Yeah @Troy Foz . You can still get away with it with care. Suggest that you use the first FULL bottle to exhaustion before starting new one. Looks like about 5 days with fridge depending on how much gas is used in cooking etc. After a while, you will be able to gauge your "normal" usage. Unfortunately, it costs the same to "fill" if it is absolutely empty or still has a kilo or so left in it because I do not know any filling station that works on weight inserted as gas. The empty weight of cylinder and the full weight with gas are usually marked on the cylinder and you can get some idea of how much is left when removing it if you have a luggage weighing scale. Otherwise a gas gauge in line with the one you are using is another option that may be of use, although I have not found them very accurate!!

 

[Drover]

There are options, a few mods would get it happening if your handy, post up some pics of front of van for the brains trust to mull over, also what's your tug.
The small bottles are handy, just the cost .

 

[Troy Foz]

@Boots in Action @Drover Yea I feel this will be essential later when I do more free camping on longer trips but the only unpowered site ill be visiting soon will be El questro in April on a non powered site for 6 days in total so if I can keep both bottles full up to that point then I should be right its just knowing whats full and whats half full i might have to weigh them as you mentioned.
You could fit at least one 9kg bottle if you fit a support frame off to the side of the apex but it would have to be beefed up (see photos).
My Tug is a 2013 GXL Prado.

 

[DRW]

We have a new van, standard it comes with 2 x 4kg (3.7kg) bottles, it was an option to have 2 x 9kg (8.5kg) bottles fitted on the "A" frame so we just take 1 extra swap and go bollte which gives us 3 bottles in total and all 3 fit in the boot. On our last van we always took a spare 4kg for the BBQ as we didnt't have a gas outlet, the new van does. Staying at Tamworth recently in above 40 degree heat for days on end we used one 3.7kg bottle in around 4 days, we have a Thetford 185 litre two door fridge which was turned up as high as it would go and really struggled with the heat. We bought a small tarp from Bunnings and put it up to shade the side where the fridge was, used a differnt fridge for beer and then we could turn the fridge down and the gas usage went down with it. If the temp is not extreme and the fridge is well insulated you will be fine with two small bottles, if going off grid for a long time I would just grab a spare bottle to be sure.

 

[Troy Foz]

We have a new van, standard it comes with 2 x 4kg (3.7kg) bottles, it was an option to have 2 x 9kg (8.5kg) bottles fitted on the "A" frame so we just take 1 extra swap and go bollte which gives us 3 bottles in total and all 3 fit in the boot. On our last van we always took a spare 4kg for the BBQ as we didnt't have a gas outlet, the new van does. Staying at Tamworth recently in above 40 degree heat for days on end we used one 3.7kg bottle in around 4 days, we have a Thetford 185 litre two door fridge which was turned up as high as it would go and really struggled with the heat. We bought a small tarp from Bunnings and put it up to shade the side where the fridge was, used a differnt fridge for beer and then we could turn the fridge down and the gas usage went down with it. If the temp is not extreme and the fridge is well insulated you will be fine with two small bottles, if going off grid for a long time I would just grab a spare bottle to be sure.

Thanks for the info @DRW I live in the NT and its always hot here so I assume ill have to make sure my fridge side is always covered.

 

[DRW]

don't get overly concerned @Troy Foz you will probably run out of water before you run out of gas, and up to around 30 degrees is okay its over 40 degrees you will suffer so you should be okay, just don't use it as a beer fridge as others have said it takes a long time to recover from door opening. If you need a 12V fridge go to the Jape homemaker centre at Millner because Anaconda and BCF are always competing against each other on price for them, win win

 

[Drover]

For later on, I would throw the spare under the rear or on the bar and fit a 8.5 kg bottle in the recess left by the spare, I quite like the smaller bottles, carry one on the road for the barbie as the bayonet on the van is a pain but the $18 to $24 a fill pusses me more.

 

[mikerezny]

If you are prepared to carry a third bottle, the following idea might be worth consideration.

First replace one of your hoses with a flexible one.
Then buy a 9kg bottle and find somewhere to carry it.
When you intend to do a long camp, pull out the 9kg bottle, put it on the ground and connect it up and run it until it is empty before switching it over to one of the 4.5kg bottles.
That way, with just one bottle you have doubled your capacity form 9kg to 18kg.
You will also save a bit of money since you will be filling up the 9kg bottle which, as we all know, can be about the same cost as filling up a 4.5 kg bottle.

You might want to note that it is now recommended, if not mandated, that the gas regulator must be mounted above the top of the gas cylinders.
A useful side effect of this idea is that the regulator is then indeed above the 9kg gas bottle.

cheers
Mike

 

[Troy Foz]

If you are prepared to carry a third bottle, the following idea might be worth consideration.

First replace one of your hoses with a flexible one.
Then buy a 9kg bottle and find somewhere to carry it.
When you intend to do a long camp, pull out the 9kg bottle, put it on the ground and connect it up and run it until it is empty before switching it over to one of the 4.5kg bottles.
That way, with just one bottle you have doubled your capacity form 9kg to 18kg.
You will also save a bit of money since you will be filling up the 9kg bottle which, as we all know, can be about the same cost as filling up a 4.5 kg bottle.

You might want to note that it is now recommended, if not mandated, that the gas regulator must be mounted above the top of the gas cylinders.
A useful side effect of this idea is that the regulator is then indeed above the 9kg gas bottle.

cheers
Mike

Thanks @mikerezny I have considered this idea earlier I'm not sure if it is standard but the ridged copper lines connecting the bottles don't seem functional I would have thought flexible lines would be better now i need to find the right size hoses.Another issue is traveling with a 9kg bottle where to put it my tug is a 2013 Prado so no tray for storage and I'm not keen on leaving it in the van.

 

[Drover]

The flexi hoses are inexpensive, have a life of about 5 yrs available most hardware shops....you can carry the 9kg in a milk crate, keeps them safe, of course use the bung in the valve.....while vibration can split the copper, poor quality flexi hoses the inner section can degrade and cause blockage with age or exposure....