16' Series Help/Advice re my Expanda weights

[XpandaOwner]

Hello, I recently purchased a second hand Jayco Expanda (2012 Expanda Outback 16.49.3HL - single axle). I am keen to ensure I keep the weight within all legal limits to avoid any safety, insurance issues etc..

I understand all of the differences between TARE, GTM & ATM and the weights plated on my van are as follows;

Tare: 1699
GTM: 1905
ATM: 2074
Axle group load capacity: 2000

However, the confusion I have that I am hoping for advice on is....

1) My axle load capacity is 2000 which is below the actual ATM so would I be right in saying that the total weight of the laden trailer actually shouldn't exceed 2000 (axle group load capacity) or the 2074 (ATM), I would have thought ATM cannot exceed Axle group load capacity. Or is it possible that axle group load capacity does not actually include the weight of the axle/ wheels?

2) I weighed my van on a weighbridge with no personal belongings on board just what was on the van when I purchased it... which was, 2x full 9kg gas bottles, tv, wind up ariel, 110ltr fridge, air-con, microwave, 2 mattresses, awning, reich auto mover installed, 2 x 82ltr water tanks (near empty), spare tyre, & table. The ATM upon weigh bridge check was 1920kg. So basically this only leaves me with 154kg before I hit the maximum ATM. If I fill the 2 water tanks to capacity I basically have no weight left for any personal belongings !

3) Is the axle group load capacity the maximum weight that should be on the axle at all times OR only when being towed? If at all times then 1 x 80kg person would not be able to enter the van without it going over the axle group load capacity!

Any suggestions ? Can I somehow get it inspected and all of the weights increased so that I can actually put some stuff in the van ?

 

[Marv_mart]

Hello, I recently purchased a second hand Jayco Expanda (2012 Expanda Outback 16.49.3HL - single axle). I am keen to ensure I keep the weight within all legal limits to avoid any safety, insurance issues etc..

I understand all of the differences between TARE, GTM & ATM and the weights plated on my van are as follows;

Tare: 1699
GTM: 1905
ATM: 2074
Axle group load capacity: 2000

However, the confusion I have that I am hoping for advice on is....

1) My axle load capacity is 2000 which is below the actual ATM so would I be right in saying that the total weight of the laden trailer actually shouldn't exceed 2000 (axle group load capacity) or the 2074 (ATM), I would have thought ATM cannot exceed Axle group load capacity. Or is it possible that axle group load capacity does not actually include the weight of the axle/ wheels?

2) I weighed my van on a weighbridge with no personal belongings on board just what was on the van when I purchased it... which was, 2x full 9kg gas bottles, tv, wind up ariel, 110ltr fridge, air-con, microwave, 2 mattresses, awning, reich auto mover installed, 2 x 82ltr water tanks (near empty), spare tyre, & table. The ATM upon weigh bridge check was 1920kg. So basically this only leaves me with 154kg before I hit the maximum ATM. If I fill the 2 water tanks to capacity I basically have no weight left for any personal belongings !

3) Is the axle group load capacity the maximum weight that should be on the axle at all times OR only when being towed? If at all times then 1 x 80kg person would not be able to enter the van without it going over the axle group load capacity!

Any suggestions ? Can I somehow get it inspected and all of the weights increased so that I can actually put some stuff in the van ?

This might help a bit!

 

[XpandaOwner]

This might help a bit!
View attachment 32017

Thank you, just to clarify I am clear on Tare, GTM, ATM etc.. What I am not clear on is on my questions regarding Axle Group Load Capacity. Specifically how the Axle Group Load Capacity of my van can be lower than the ATM and if the Axle Group Load Capacity does not actually include the axle and wheel weight itself or does it.

 

[XpandaOwner]

Update from my original post... I emptied my water tanks and discovered they where not empty and contained 110litres (110kg) so therefore my total ATM with both water tanks full and no personal belongings would be 1974, leaving me exactly 100kg for personal belongings to reach my maximum ATM of 2074. So not great but at least better than my first thought...

What I am still not clear on is how the AXle Group Load Capacity (2000kg) listed on my plate can be lower than the maximum ATM and wether on not the Axle a Group Load Capacity does or does not include the actual weight of the axle and wheels?

 

[ShaneT]

remember your ball weight comes off your axle weight. So if your van weighs 2074kg and your ball weight is 174kg the actual weight on your axle is 1900kg.

 

[Crusty181]

Hello, I recently purchased a second hand Jayco Expanda (2012 Expanda Outback 16.49.3HL - single axle). I am keen to ensure I keep the weight within all legal limits to avoid any safety, insurance issues etc..

I understand all of the differences between TARE, GTM & ATM and the weights plated on my van are as follows;

Tare: 1699
GTM: 1905
ATM: 2074
Axle group load capacity: 2000

However, the confusion I have that I am hoping for advice on is....

1) My axle load capacity is 2000 which is below the actual ATM so would I be right in saying that the total weight of the laden trailer actually shouldn't exceed 2000 (axle group load capacity) or the 2074 (ATM), I would have thought ATM cannot exceed Axle group load capacity. Or is it possible that axle group load capacity does not actually include the weight of the axle/ wheels?

2) I weighed my van on a weighbridge with no personal belongings on board just what was on the van when I purchased it... which was, 2x full 9kg gas bottles, tv, wind up ariel, 110ltr fridge, air-con, microwave, 2 mattresses, awning, reich auto mover installed, 2 x 82ltr water tanks (near empty), spare tyre, & table. The ATM upon weigh bridge check was 1920kg. So basically this only leaves me with 154kg before I hit the maximum ATM. If I fill the 2 water tanks to capacity I basically have no weight left for any personal belongings !

3) Is the axle group load capacity the maximum weight that should be on the axle at all times OR only when being towed? If at all times then 1 x 80kg person would not be able to enter the van without it going over the axle group load capacity!

Any suggestions ? Can I somehow get it inspected and all of the weights increased so that I can actually put some stuff in the van ?

I think you already know all the answers ... The gas isn't included in the Tare, theres 17 odd kg's anyway. Maybe some or all the accessories were added by the previous owner after purchase, any water will obviously add but that still wouldn't take you to the 220 kgs you are looking at. I suspect Jayco will quote the GTM in regards to your axel loading ... if its still got the original tires you may also find your tire maximums are also close to the ATM.

All the Jayco weights are conservative and don't leave a lot of room for adding stuff. An engineer can increase the weights, sometimes within the hardware you have, sometimes by adjusting a few thing like the axel, sometimes not without a major rebuild.

 

[Drover]

Know what your on about, I would have thought it would have had a higher axle rate, I would check the Load rating of your rims and tyres while your at it they should be at least 10% higher than your GTM or is it ATM.
But I would take the information on the compliance plate with a grain of salt as Jayco seem to regularly put wrong info on them, tyre and rim size are regularly wrong so I can't see why axle rating isn't as well, mine came with under rated tyres.
I would hazard to say that most vans would not comply weight wise as once water tanks, gas bottles are full there's not much left for the extras like food, awning, beer etc.

 

[achjimmy]

Presuming it's a leaf spring model? I don't know the axle load on the JTech modeles . The 16:49-3 before the JTech suspension used a 50mm sq axle. That's only rated to 2000kg. So with that model you sail pretty close to the wind. Although a 50mm axle will take a fair load it's the rest you need to be careful off. Watch the springs, on ours being up on ATM and maybe over most of the time they sagged and flattened out quite quickley. Unfortntley AlKo don't make a higher rated spring again. The silver alloy wheels they used are also quite poor and prone to cracking and the 15" tyres they give you also have very little leeway for load.

You'll need to manage your load, unless regularly attending a nudist starvation colony you won't travel with only a 100kg of payload.

One way to manage is travel with little water and fill up near your destination if free camping. Load more in the car if it can take it. No way condoning overloading but you are pretty well in a bind. Yes you can get it re engineered but no engineer is going to re rate a 50mm axle above 2t so you will be looking at an expensive path with 3t axles etc.

 

[XpandaOwner]

Thank you Jim, makes sense.. I will take your advice on board (although the nudist starvation colony was on the cards for a future trip). Yes, it is a leaf spring model and it has larger truck tyres on it, but I will check the weights on them.

Drover, I had forgot the beer so in theory I will only have around 5kg left for personal belongings.

 

[Drover]

I wouldn't worry too much though, if everyone took there rigs over a bridge they would be shocked but hopefully not surprised as to what the weigh bridge ticket would have on it. A 14ft single axle van should have at least a tyre with a load rating of 112 and for yours I'd have a 114 and rims of 1200kg LR.
All this talk though is getting me intrigued as to what my "Tardis" would be on the scales when loaded, me thinks a bit more than the 1800 the plate says................................nah, put head back in sand.

 

[crackacoldie]

What's wrong with going to a nudist starvation colony @achjimmy ???

 

[achjimmy]

What's wrong with going to a nudist starvation colony @achjimmy ???

What's wrong with it @crackacoldie I havent found a female only nudist colony that will let me in :-(

 

[JT76]

Sorry to dig up a old thread but didn't think it was worth starting a new one for this.

I checked our compliance plate today and noticed the Tare weight is left blank? Everything else is listed but no Tare weight, is this normal? As I searched on the forum I have noticed a few pics of plates with the Tare listed.

Anyone else missing their Tare weight from their compliance plate?

 

[Drover]

It would probably have been wrong anyway but it shows how well the compliance for registration is done by various qualified (??) people not to mention the QC of the manufacturer, most plates have something wrong with them anyway. I would contact Jayco and ask for a plate that complies or stir the pot and go to the regulator and ask whats going on ????

 

[Jamcor]

Something else to consider also does it run the bigger parallal wheel brgs i know on the pop top camper (jayco) it was only on the swan and flamingo i think that had them outback models not sure on expandas only new to forum still learning

 

[JT76]

Thanks, ill give them a call tomorrow and see what they say. Its not really worrying me but may as well sort it out.

 

[Drover]

The only way to check wheel bearing type and part number is to pull the hub off and actually look, too many people go on the say so of others and they don't fit when you need them, the bearing/axle combo may not be the same on similar models, I think it may depend on whats on the shelf.

 

[17triton]

Sorry to dig up a old thread but didn't think it was worth starting a new one for this.

I checked our compliance plate today and noticed the Tare weight is left blank? Everything else is listed but no Tare weight, is this normal? As I searched on the forum I have noticed a few pics of plates with the Tare listed.

Anyone else missing their Tare weight from their compliance plate?

Did you get a weighbridge ticket in your pack with the paperwork and dvd?

 

[jbell6660]

I don't have a tare on my Journey plate. Quizzed Jayco Sydney is it legal and they replied all their vans come from the factory without the tare stamped but it is on the rego papers. I also have noticed photos of compliance plates showing tare stamped!!!! Mine is a April 2015.

 

[MDS69]

Mine is Sep 2014 and has no tare on the plate.