Y62 Patrol

[GC Caravan Hire]

I'm starting to get an urge to change tow vehicles. Currently we have a 2012 NW Pajero which had been great, but the painful towball weight is going to cause me some issues (i.e under 2.5t 250kg ball, over 2.5t 180kg ball). So I have started to have a look at a y62 patrol, and would be interested to hear what they are like on fuel when towing, I.e what mileage are you getting, with what van on the back?

Part of the reason behind this on our last trip over Xmas with our 16.49-3 ob on the back ended up with 14.5l/100 sitting on 100-110kph for the run from Gympie to the Gold Coast. 2 days later with our 18.58-2ob sitting on 90-100kph mileage was 18.5/100 on the run back up to Hervey Bay. That being said, on the way home tucked in behind a b double from the Gympie back to the coast @ 100-110kph it ended up 15.5/100.

Both vans are similar height (18.58 had roof aircon, so it's a fraction higher) other then that there is about a 400kg difference in the weight of the vans.

I have a few more vans coming along, that are full height Starcrafts (and possibly an ob basestation for good measure), so was starting to thing that the Pajero may end up closer to 20l/100 with the taller vans (and it can't tow the basestation), which I think would have to be getting somewhere around what the y62 runs?

Key thing for the new tow car is must have 7 seats, and can tow 3.5t. Struggling to justify the extra 30k for a new vx cruiser over a y62 as that buys a hell of a lot of fuel, (and the boring accountant in me doesn't like going too far over luxury car limits as I hate leaving money on the table for the ato).

 

[bigcol]

have a look at http://www.nissanpatrol.com.au/forums/forumdisplay.php?130-Y62-Nissan-Patrol

that is the address for the Y62 with lots of write ups and stories about them

there is a few people I know who tow with them, and if I had the coin, I would too

 

[Doc]

After you take out some of the variables like weather (eg wind strength and direction), vehicle accessories (eg roof racks, bullbars etc), traffic density and flow....the biggest single factor impacting fuel economy is the organic one that turns the steering wheel and pushes the pedals. As such, I find little value in "comparing" fuel economy with others.

Since you asked I will give you my results, but there is a 50% chance that your results will be different or the same as mine (see - lies, damn lies, and statistics)

22.68-1 OB TL, ATM of 3212kg. I use cruise control wherever I can safely do so (set at the speed limit), towing in "D" (Y62 operates with a locked up torque converter in every gear except 1st), and do not slow down for hills to try and save fuel. Basically, I do NOT drive for economy as I couldn't really give a tinkers cuss what fuel costs.

When towing, I have gotten as "low" as 20.2l/100km. I have gotten as "high" as 27.4l/100km. The 'normal' towing figure seems to be around 22-23l/100km.

While some may be shocked at what they see as high usage, others may be surprised at what they see as very competitive with other similar sized/rated vehicles. I guess opinions really ARE like....well.....lets say 'eyelashes'

 

[achjimmy]

Yep fuel consumption is a big thing for most. I've always been amazed how it drives people's thinking. If towing your business then you want what will do the business?

I definetly don't drive for economy and I'd say I'd be about 4l/100 under @Doc over similar circumstances but I do have muddies, roof rack etc etc but the van is only 2.7t so it's not huge difference? I love the delivery of diesel torque though so for me it's not fuel.

Personally if it was me being in the towing business I'd go a Dodge Ram ! but there goes your budget and it only has seating for 6. Or 12 if we were allowed to ride around in the back like the good ol USofA

 

[yabbietol]

I do not know about the Nissan, but we like our new GX LC200 for towing, though economy is around 22l/100k towing at 100kph in various conditions. Hopefully it will get better as the engine settles in, but the fuel economy is not my prime towing consideration. However, towing safety is most important to us, we have owned two Pajero's (NP and NW) and they tow well, but at around 2.5t (and above) they are feeling a bit limited, the much larger and heavier LC220 just feels right (compared to the Pajero) as a tow once you get to a 2.5t caravan. The Pajero is a great tow vehicle and towed our 1.2t Avan Cruiseliner like a dream, but you sound like you are getting to the Pajero's towing limits. Think about safety and comfort then get a bigger heavier tow, it is really hard to move on from such a great vehicle as the Pajero, but once you do you will think this is good.

The Nissan Y62 or the LC200 both sound like good choices. I am not sure why you are looking at the VX compared to the Nissan, a much more logical comparison for the 7 seater would be the GLX LC200 (and for 5 seater the GX). The cost savings on the GLX vs the VX buys a lot of very neat extras and gives the Gov a lot less luxury car tax.

PS our NW Pajero got an average 18l to 21l per 100k towing our full height 2.5t off road Kedron in a variety of conditions, but the 88l fuel tank was a pain as was the 250 kg tow ball weight. The LC200 much larger 138l fuel tank(s) is great as is the higher 350kg tow ball weight (which legally allows 2 jerry cans on the caravan A frame).

 

[Hubble80]

Towing my 22.68OB with our LC200 I get pretty much the same as @Doc gets with his Y62. My wife and I had some very serious discussions about trading to a Y62, but resale was the biggest thorn in my side. If I was going to trade up from say a Prado or Pajero, the Y62 would be at the top of my list.

I know a few people with them and one has had a better exhaust fitted. He improved his economy by almost 3L/100km.

 

[Doc]

I think @Hubble80 raises a good point about resale. Compared to retail sticker prices, the LC200 absolutely FLOGS the Y62 on resale percentages if you use retail pricing as your baseline (and realistically, there is no other way to even semi-accurately do it). I don't know anyone who would dispute the high resale percentage of an LC200, for whatever reasons that occurs. (Hell, I'm not in the business if dissing the LC200 - good vehicle IMO - but there is no way on Gods green earth that I would pay $130k for one that has the same spec as my Ti-L (I paid $54.5k drive away for a demo vehicle - not kidding - but that was the deal of a lifetime.)

However using what people ACTUALLY pay as a baseline, the differences are dramatically less. (The thing is, its nigh-on impossible to actually quantify those numbers with any statistical merit.) Example: plenty of people paying 'low 60's' for Ti model Y62, whose sticker d/a price is $76.5k (compared to a VX LC200 which is the equivalent Toyota model which has a sticker d/a price of ~$107k!). And these are not "dealer stock" vehicles sitting in yards collecting dust - these are vehicles which are not even due to roll down the factory line until June 2017! We live in an interesting world

 

[Dobbie]

Me....I buy for what will do the towing task with ease and safety. Towing a van, I accept that fuel efficiency is impaired considerably....we get between 14 and 18 / 100 towing, depending on winds, hills and climate.

That's fine by me.

I was affected by purchase price but if I buy new, I know I can knock off 20pc on resale immediately. It what happens after that I take into consideration. If I want to keep the vehicle for at least five years, I'll spend the $$ to set it up the way I want it, but not if its a shorter term hold.

Having bought a very low km demonstrator, I know my resale will be lower later but later is later and I'm not second guessing...but I am aware of it.

In an ideal world, I'd walk in and buy a 200 series cruiser with exactly what I want fitted. ...but I can't afford it!
Meantime, I'll make do with my Y61 Patrol and appreciate that the lower cost allows me to travel more.

 

[bigcol]

I am a firm believer that if you buy for re-sale, your wasting your money

as @Doc points out - there is a rather large difference in initial price between the Y62 and the VX/GXL (equivalent level)
which has always been the case with Patrol V's Landcruiser - always
but

when you look at it percentage wise (initial cost V's 2nd had price) both are pretty much even


biggest problem I see with the Y62 V's 200 is that alot of people try to equate the GX model Cruiser with the Ti-L Patrol
maybe closer in price, but vastly different in features

lets compare "Apples V's Apples, not Apples V's Bananas"

in Perth RRP is (for equivalent trim level)

Mitsubishi Pajero Exceed - $63990 (https://www.mitsubishi-motors.com.au/vehicles/pajero/range )
L'Cruiser 200 VX - $99170 (http://www.toyota.com.au/landcruise...yota_ShowroomPage_Suvs_LandCruiser 200_Prices )
Patrol Y62 - $78393 (http://www.nissan.com.au/Cars-Vehicles/Patrol/Overview )

now we all know better deals can be had by walking in to the showroom - this is the RRP for Perth - today 9.10am

your $20K you save is a heck of a lot of fuel - maybe 3 or 4 years worth

 

[Doc]

@bigcol
The ONLY issue I have with what you wrote is that you quoted the price of a GXL LC200, not a VX Then the difference creeps out to 30 grand

The Nissan website ONLY shows "driveaway" pricing, where the Toyota site shows both RRP (before on-road costs), and then shows you the actual d/a price.

 

[davemc]

No one wants a Disco
Been happy so far with our new D4 although its not a year old yet so still not lost all the oil

We get 16-18's with the 22.68 but touring so around 2750

 

[bigcol]

No one wants a Disco

unfortunately, you're probably closer to the mark than you think @davemc

they are a great car - just to much "advanced" features for the average person (air suspension / electronics / etc)

 

[bigcol]

@bigcol
The ONLY issue I have with what you wrote is that you quoted the price of a GXL LC200, not a VX Then the difference creeps out to 30 grand

nah, I did do the VX, but never put in the drive away price - as the others didnt have that price showing


but you get that

 

[achjimmy]

You will drive away in a VX for $93-95k GXL $78-80k

 

[Red1]

We just picked our Ti-L, $83 drive away. Gets 12.8 l/100 without towing anything, 24 pulling the expanda(3.2 tonne after running it over the weigh bridge). 200 owners will say that is high. I traded a petrol 200 to get this and it was way worse than 24. We looked at a diesel 200 because we really liked the toyota, but it would take a long time to recoupe $30 k difference between the two at only a couple of litres / hundred difference.
Cheers

 

[bigcol]

You will drive away in a VX for $93-95k GXL $78-80k

I quoted off the net - for delivery to post code 6000

as I said

now we all know better deals can be had by walking in to the showroom - this is the RRP for Perth - today 9.10am

 

[GC Caravan Hire]

No one wants a Disco
Been happy so far with our new D4 although its not a year old yet so still not lost all the oil

We get 16-18's with the 22.68 but touring so around 2750

to many friends with disco's and I have seen what happens when they get a few years on them, when the suspension goes, seats, crap out, etc and everything starts at a grand to fix . Not really too sure on the seating room in them as well, I see them as more akin to the Pajero in terms of internal luggage space, without the Pajero extra boot space from where the 3rd row normally hides.

 

[achjimmy]

to many friends with disco's and I have seen what happens when they get a few years on them, when the suspension goes, seats, crap out, etc and everything starts at a grand to fix . Not really too sure on the seating room in them as well, I see them as more akin to the Pajero in terms of internal luggage space, without the Pajero extra boot space from where the 3rd row normally hides.

Yep but till the seats crap out they are the best

 

[GC Caravan Hire]

I do not know about the Nissan, but we like our new GX LC200 for towing, though economy is around 22l/100k towing at 100kph in various conditions. Hopefully it will get better as the engine settles in, but the fuel economy is not my prime towing consideration. However, towing safety is most important to us, we have owned two Pajero's (NP and NW) and they tow well, but at around 2.5t (and above) they are feeling a bit limited, the much larger and heavier LC220 just feels right (compared to the Pajero) as a tow once you get to a 2.5t caravan. The Pajero is a great tow vehicle and towed our 1.2t Avan Cruiseliner like a dream, but you sound like you are getting to the Pajero's towing limits. Think about safety and comfort then get a bigger heavier tow, it is really hard to move on from such a great vehicle as the Pajero, but once you do you will think this is good.

The Nissan Y62 or the LC200 both sound like good choices. I am not sure why you are looking at the VX compared to the Nissan, a much more logical comparison for the 7 seater would be the GLX LC200 (and for 5 seater the GX). The cost savings on the GLX vs the VX buys a lot of very neat extras and gives the Gov a lot less luxury car tax.

PS our NW Pajero got an average 18l to 21l per 100k towing our full height 2.5t off road Kedron in a variety of conditions, but the 88l fuel tank was a pain as was the 250 kg tow ball weight. The LC200 much larger 138l fuel tank(s) is great as is the higher 350kg tow ball weight (which legally allows 2 jerry cans on the caravan A frame).

From what I can gather the ti patrol is equivalent to vx cruiser, and ti-l to Sahara. Which is why i was looking that direction.

Leather sears, etc with the kids isn't a bad thing, either. So would probably head that direction over a gxl.

 

[achjimmy]

There lots of reasons as to why we buy fourbies and they will be to suit you. And most will defend their decisions. The truth is you won't buy a crap fourbie here now which is great.

Is resale important it is when your leasing cause lease companies love Toyota resale. You can release 4 plus yr old toyotas because of there excellent resale .


For mine why I discounted the Y62 was a couple of reasons but the biggest was because Nissan are p***ks . Not just the whole 3litre hand grenade era but also the fuel pumps in them. And their crap excuse blaming it on bad fuel. Then we had xtrails and again there warranty was crap, the tow wiring kit doesn't use a relay like every other supplier but when it burns the toy loom out Nissan won't warrant it ffs! . I hope the Y62 is great for those who have them cause Nissan are hopeless at supporting problems. Actually it's funny how people use lack of dealer support in the bush for discounting the disco but Nissan wouldn't be far behind?.. really the only two maybe three brands with every town support is 1. Toyota 2. GMH 3. Ford.

Depends what your priorities are for many it's price and that's great.