16' Series Sorry more questions on 16.49 outback expanda...

[ChantalB]

Hi again,

I'll apologie now if some of these questions are a bit silly - still a big newbie to all things caravanning. Ok, so we are looking at purchasing the 2011 16.49 outback expanda and the dealership has one with a dinette set up in stock. Went back to them with some questions on extras that we wanted and some of their answers were a bit confusing and I'm hoping you more experienced caravanners would be able to shed some light......

1. We wanted an extra gas bottle ie) 2 on the front of van but the salesman said that it can't be done because of the Size of the spare tyre?? Doesn't make sense to me as the tyre is the normal outback size - hasn't been upgraded and ive seen so many photos of expandas with 2 gas bottles. Has anyone else encountered this?

2. Apparently we don't need an Anderson plug as it has an "inbuilt trickle charger"? I thought you needed an Anderson plug to charge your van battery whilst driving? Does the trickle charge do the same thing or do you need an Anderson plug as well?

3. Solar pack - apparently this only charges your caravan battery? Does this mean that the solar only provides power for your lights? Would it still operate your microwave and other electrics like a kettle? And I'm assuming you would use the gas option to run the fridge.

4. Lastly (for now anyway) what would a 100 amp battery do and why would you need it?

Thanks everyone!!

 

[Brad]

Hmmm... Point 1 and 2 sound more like they do not want to do any further mods on floor stock. Most options are completed in factory before getting to the dealership. So I think this guy is drinking his bath water with point 1. You can charge the battery via a 12 pin plug but the issue is that the cable in the plugs are not necessarily thick enough for the charge flowing through the cable. Hence you could burn the wire. An Anderson plug uses thicker wires thus is more compliant with the charge being sent from car to van.
Point 3 - unless you have an item called an inverter, then anything connected to a power outlet looking like a home outlet does not run on battery. You can go as far as getting a generator but even that will not power everything. This will include your aircon.
So yes batteries generally run lights, TV, can run fridge (but I think this just maintains the current temp) and anything set up as a 12 volt device. I bet you get a few differing replies on this point. But for what you get when driving the caravan out of the dealership, assume batteries run lights, a tv and your fridge. Everything else is added on after market.
Point 4 I would need to ask my brother (the electrician). So hope someone else can answer this.

 

[ChantalB]

Thanks heaps Brad, Appreciate the quick response. So much to learn.... By the way saw the mods you did on your van and they look great.

 

[cruza driver]

1. I cant see why they cant do 2 gas bottles for you as all mdl's with a HWS has 2 bottles so it shouldn't be a problem I wouldn't think

2. An anderson plug does charge your van battery quicker whilst travelling so this enables your van battery to charge quicker (as the cabling is bigger) between overnight stops etc when on the road and not connected to mains power. The anderson plug should be disconnected as to not drain the cars battery when parked (it can happen if you are using alot of power but could take a while)

3. Solar does charge your van battery which powers all 12v appliances like light etc. The microwave and 240v power points only works when the van is plugged into mains power.

4. You need a battery to supply power and use any lighting, stove ignighter etc when not connected to mains power.

 

[straydingo]

Hi
The only silly question is the one not asked!

1. This is a standard option. Unless something has changed dramatically, there should be no reason why it can be done.
Print the following photo and give it to him and ask why not.

2. others are better qualified to answer this as I don't have a battery installed, but I believe the battery can be charged by one of the pins on a 12 pin plug, an anderson plug, when connected to a 240v source at a caravan park, or solar panels. If installing a battery, I'd suggest the anderson plug is the better option over the wiring in a 12 pin plug, but you will also need to have to have the other end fitted on the car.
3. Don't know - others to answer
4. If you want to free camp - ie not plug in at a caravan park each time you stop, you'll want a battery to power the lights (fridge and cooking on gas only tho). If you don't intend to free camp you don't need to spend the money on that one. The wiring for the battery itself is still installed in OB models as standard even if you don't install the battery straight away. However that changes the answers to 2 and 3 as they won't be relevant - unless you having all the wiring for anderson and solar installed now for use later. Solar panels can also be added later.

 

[ChantalB]

Thanks guys, just to clarify the battery question. In the brochure, as an internal option you can select an auxiliary battery and then under the outback options you can select the 100 amp battery. I guess that's what's confusing me as I thought that you would only need 1 battery which would operate the lights etc. is there a difference between the auxiliary battery and the 100 amp battery? Just trying to find out as much as I can before we go back to the dealer again.

 

[Brad]

A batteries ability to power items is based in the amount of amps you draw from the battery. A light globe for instance draws more amps from a battery than a led light. This is one reason why people change their lights to LED because a LED draws less amps than a normal light globe.
So a battery with a lot of amps can be drawn on a lot more than a battery with a lower amp rating.
Plug two batteries together and you have more amps to play with or power items longer before you fully drain the battery.

 

[straydingo]

In a 'standard' expanda the battery wiring isn't included normally, so the 'auxillary battery' referred to is the wiring kit (maybe also with the battery). In the OB models, the wiring is already there standard, so the option is then do you want the actual battery also.

 

[ChantalB]

Ok so basically it just means that if we had the auxilliary battery and the 100 amp battery we would greater battery power and would take longer to run out of battery power. If we only had 1 battery it just means a shorter battery life before we need to recharge and would be best to go for the most amps.

 

[cruza driver]

If you are going to camp away from mains power an battery is requiered to power your 12v side of the van (lights etc).

The 100amp battery is the size most people get myself included, and it lasts about 3-4 days before needing recharging.
If you add solar in the mix the solar will keep the battery charged as long as the charge input is higher than the battery output.

The auxillary battery is the 100 amp battery. As SD also said the wiring will be standard in the OB, but the anderson wiring is an extra that cost about $100 from factory.


If my Expanda battery is running low I can plug my anderson plug in as the anderson plug wiring is connected to my 2nd isolated battery in the Cruiser.

 

[ChantalB]

Ok - we do want the battery as well so will get that included as well. Think I'll be writing another list of things to go back to them about tomorrow and at least I'll be a lot more informed! Thanks all

 

[cancan]

Just a note when wiring an anderson plug to your car, I added a switch (can't remember official terminology) so when the car battery got down to a set level it cut power to the anderson plug.
as everything in our car is electronic we didn't want to stop for lunch and come back to a dead car

 

[ChantalB]

Good point cancan, will have to investigate - hate to come back to a dead car battery with 3 kids asking when are we going to get there!

 

[Brad]

Check out a website like www.pirhanaoffroad.com.au. They will have a product that will do just this.

 

[Capt. Gadget]

http://www.piranhaoffroad.com.au/

 

[expanda]

You can just get a relay / solenoid which cuts power to the anderson plug as soon as you turn the key off which is much easier.....

The battery is a great idea but ill stick my neck out as I know there is alot of people who use and love them but I think the anderson plug is overkill unless you do alot of free camping.

The normal 7 / 12 pin trailer plug supplied by Jayco is just as good in its operation from my experience.

One thing which is overlooked is the condition of the car battery, towing alot and having the van connected puts additional load / stress on the battery and regardless of anderson plug / trailer plug etc you may be better of upgrading your battery in the car to deal with the new van. I killed my battery pretty quickly when I got the van and got a nice decent battery installed and haven't looked back. Dual batteries is on the cards and then I would flip over to anderson but for now the standard trailer plug was fine.

I realise the anderson has its advantages like if you free camp alot but the battery / fridge will run fine off the trailer plug.

 

[straydingo]

I have the anderson plug going to the fride only as I don't have a battery. When getting the the ando plug on the car, I elected not to get a cut off switch intending to disconnect the plug when stopped for long periods.
I forgot on the ferry to Kangeroo Island (40-45 minutes) and the battery was dead when I went to get the car and van off, so it doesn't take a long time to drain!! (I do carry one of those cheap portable jumper packs tho and was going again in a couple of minutes)

 

[ElectricGuru]

Hey ChantalB, congrats on going with the Expanda. A couple of points just to throw my two cents in...

Brad had it right with regards to power usage but bear in mind that two batteries also adds issues such as doubling your charging current requirements and also the weight. A 100 Ahr battery can weigh upwards of 30 kg so that reduces the amount you can carry in the van. Also the towing vehicle needs to have the alternator capacity to provide for the extra load and the cabling needs to be able to handle the extra current without having issues with voltage drop. A single 100 Ahr battery should be enough if you change to LED lighting. With good solar charging and the fridge on gas, you should be able to free camp for up to a week no problems.

An Anderson (or 12 pin) plug with a Battery Isolating Relay to protect the car battery when stopped is the best idea. Also I have put a Low Voltage Cutout Relay on my fridge circuit so when we stop for long periods, it doesn't kill the van battery. Just ask your auto electrician to look at this when you get your brake controller fitted (assuming that you haven't got that done yet, get it done prior to picking up the van).

The inbuilt trickle charger is probably the Setec 12 Vdc power supply unit that powers all your 12 V loads when connected to mains power. This unit has a battery charger built in but wont charge while driving.

Otherwise good luck with the caravan purchase and hope to see some photos soon...

 

[theturnerclan]

Hi Guys,

Had this same dilemna when we ordered our 16.49 OB in 2010. what goes where and with with wire does what?

This is what I have done.

1. Dual batteries in the car. Second is a deep cycle battery.

2. Ando plug from the car to van charges two van batteries while driving.

3. Seperate 6mm wire runs from car battery to van to run fridge while driving or engine running. cuts out when ignition is off. This wire runs through a spare pin in my 12 pin connection.

4. Pos and Neg wire to rear of car from scond battery to run engel while driving or parked. This gets run of the van batteries while set up.

5. The two batteries in the van are both 100 a/h gel cel batteries. These are great for vans being deep cycle and completely sealed for use inside a van. They also cope very well with bumps encountered on dirt roads.

good luck with it all. just remember the smaller the wires used, the more risk of burning them out and burning down the house.

Cheers

Rick

 

[achjimmy]

Remember if you order the battery with the van it is included in its payload.