18' Series My tow vehicle bounces while towing

[bigcol]

you pump them up before you put the Van / trailer / horse float on


then, when you attach, you lower (release air) the pressure until it sits "nice"
measure what the pressure is

then when you un-hook, measure pressure again, and this will give you 2 ideas
1) how much needs to be put in before you hook up
2) how much compression (from the weight) is happening to your suspension

 

[EDT82]

Yeah each to there own with how to set air bags up. I have Firestone coil-rites with the high pressure sleeves(max 60psi). I've had poly air before and have popped a bag in the past by there procedure.. Fire stones instructions are set to min 5 psi when not loaded and loaded inflate intill van an load levels. When I had the poly air they replaced the bag and recommended to me on the phone that setting bags to 10-15 psi and inflate or deflate as required. They also said never use a servo self serve compressor. The explanation to me is. If you pumped a balloon up and jumped on it or slowly stood on it pressure rises in balloon and burst.. Same as theory in hydraulics compression equals force. So yes each to there own but from my experience setting at 10psi (once loaded would probably rise to 15psi give or take)and the raising is the go. (Firestone instructions) Also I've never used a compressor to pump air bags up, I use a decent racing bike tyre hand pump(good for 100psi). I have 350-500kg HD pedders trakryder suspension with Firestone HD coilrite airbags with high pressure sleeves.. Im personally not concerned for wdh has we hit the dirt/off-road tracks. And we have Esc to eliminate the sway. I placed a switched relay in car so I can turn Esc off when on the beaten tracks.. (yes we've only used our new van twice in a month of having but will hit the same tracks as we did our Swan). I hope all info is helping Lozza. Lol

 

[Drover]

Thats the way @EDT82 , but some pump the bags so they do all the work which is not wise................................................I need WDH for highway running as the wind gets under the Ute and lifts the front end up at 100kph, with a lifted suspension I run out of travel and it gets a bit floaty, need to add a winch to the bar to hold it down....good as gold on rough roads though.

 

[Dobbie]

Thanks for the help....I'm very glad I asked as I now am better informed and will treat the pumping of air bags with caution.

They've been fitted more as a precaution and my vehicle setup is so conservative and stock standard that I'll never stray from that though the rear bumper is now sprouting two trailer plugs, two Anderson plugs and the airbag valves, as well as the tow bar. It looks like a Christmas tree.

@Lozza T

Apologies for adding to the digression....yet another sin!

 

[EDT82]

Thats the way @EDT82 , but some pump the bags so they do all the work which is not wise................................................I need WDH for highway running as the wind gets under the Ute and lifts the front end up at 100kph, with a lifted suspension I run out of travel and it gets a bit floaty, need to add a winch to the bar to hold it down....good as gold on rough roads though.

Lol yeah understandable I've got the winch and a tribe of kids so need the ooomph underneath. Yes I do see a lot rely totally on airbags and they will do damage if not used correctly.. Yeah we sit pretty level with our car loaded up with 4 kids with the upgraded suspension( lifted aswell)the car just drops under level not by much and not much pressure is needed to bring to height back up.

 

[4wdphil]

Hi All,
I went to pick up my van yesterday from where it is being stored to take it home in preparation for the Christmas Holiday Trip.
It was only the 2nd time towing the new van but this time I was in the car on my own so I had no family distractions which meant I could really assess how my Triton tows the 2.2 ton (unladen) van.
One thing that is a little concerning is that there is a little bounce. It does not happen all the time. It is more prominent during cruising speed at around 80-90kms and is less noticeable if you are accelerating.
This will definitely annoy the 3 kids and wife during the 3.5hr trip to the Prom.

Theory 1:
Is the tow ball height critical? When I hook the van on, the Triton only drops about 10-15mm. I have upgraded the suspension with Iron Performance Foam Cell and raised the rear about 50mm so I am certain the suspension is fine. However, I think that the tow ball height may need to be raised. It appears that the van is not sitting level while hooked on the van and could possibly be raised 50mm - 100mm to get it closer to level. The fact that the van is sitting lower at the tow ball could this be contributing to the bounce? See photo.....

View attachment 46659

Therefore would the solution be to buy a new tow hitch that is adjustable to achieve the height required? Like this photo? From Supercheap Auto for $385
View attachment 46662
Theory 2:
My tyres need balancing. Currently booked in to be done on Tuesday.

Theory 3:
I simply need a weight distribution kit. Prices seem to be from $600 to $1200.
My spec plate on the van states that I have an 'empty ball weight' of 181kg. My Triton has a max towball download of 300kg. Should I be allowing for approx 225kg-250kg?

Does anyone else have a similar vehicle set up?
Any advice would be most appreciative.

Hi Lozza T

Definitely get the WDH, BUT I would not be getting a Hayman Reece. Have a look at the Anderson WDH. This is what I bought this time round and it is so dam easy to set up and is awesome. It also acts as and anti sway and there is no noise, also you don't have to disconnect them when driving up gutters or when backing. To connect all you have to do is while connect to the vehicle is raise the hitch with the jockey wheel connect the bottom plate then lower - this is once it is all set up. I have seen a couple of other vanner out there with them as well and they are extremely happy with it as am I.

Any way Google it and make up your own mind.

Happy holidays

 

[17triton]

I have an MN as well and towing the 17-58-3 Starcraft which is very similiar in size to yours and wouldn't tow without it. I have towed to the local jayco dealer without and the bounceing would drive you nuts on a big trip. I have airbags as well but don't use them now I have good springs in the rear. I only fitted them when I had towing issues with another van and wasted my money. ( you can buy them off me if you want them). Airbags on the MN is a bit risky as it puts pressure on an area of chassis not designed to take a lot of load. I definately wouldnt load them up then tow on rough roads with them. The WDH takes most of that pitching and bouncing out and puts the weight back on the front wheels where you need it. I run a Haymen setup but the Aderson ones get a lot of good reviews. Hope that helps.

 

[The escapist]

As others have said, a WDH should help level your rig more. I recently bought a medium weight one from Road Tech Marine which, so far, I'm pretty happy with. Only $359... Something to consider. https://www.roadtechmarine.com.au/rapid-bar-600-weight-distribution-kit-275kg-ball-capacity/p/RTE042

Personally, I wouldn't run air bags on a leaf spring rear end. If over inflated they can bend chassis when towing as where they're placed is not meant to carry load. Where the springs are bolted is where the load should be. When you raised the rear did they add a leaf for extra load? In my Triton, when I replaced the rear springs, it was only raised 25mm. I replaced them more for the extra load I was carrying (canopy, fridge, dual battery as well as either boat or van). I had a leaf added so there was less flex in the springs when empty but when loaded there was little drop and the car handled a lot better. With the upgraded springs and an old HR WDH on the Heritage (roughly 1,900kg loaded) it towed beautifully. Not exactly the same as your 2.2T @Lozza T, but in the ball park.

Never towed the expanda with the Triton, had too many problems with it so sold it before upgrading the van.

Daz

 

[Lozza T]

I have an MN as well and towing the 17-58-3 Starcraft which is very similiar in size to yours and wouldn't tow without it. I have towed to the local jayco dealer without and the bounceing would drive you nuts on a big trip. I have airbags as well but don't use them now I have good springs in the rear. I only fitted them when I had towing issues with another van and wasted my money. ( you can buy them off me if you want them). Airbags on the MN is a bit risky as it puts pressure on an area of chassis not designed to take a lot of load. I definately wouldnt load them up then tow on rough roads with them. The WDH takes most of that pitching and bouncing out and puts the weight back on the front wheels where you need it. I run a Haymen setup but the Aderson ones get a lot of good reviews. Hope that helps.

Thanks @17triton
I will check out both options tomorrow.
The Andersen option seems very different with the chain set up. I need to fully understand how it works and compare it too the typical bar option.

 

[dagree]

Min of 5psi when not under load? As in, not towing?

:encouragement:
That's when I remember to deflate them!!!!!!!!!! Certainly feel it when going over bumps and no van on the back!!!!

Max of 40psi when need for load?

Now how long is a piece of string????? Maximum also depends on brand of air bags...... Mine has a max of 30psi.
Also the pressure you require depends on the amount of lift required. Your option of starting at 10psi and working from there is the way to go..
Run mine at 26psi fully loaded to get everything level and tows like a dream! 15psi when not loaded.

do you use the gauge on the compressor or just a tyre gauge?

Digital tyre guage here

 

[Lozza T]

As others have said, a WDH should help level your rig more. I recently bought a medium weight one from Road Tech Marine which, so far, I'm pretty happy with. Only $359... Something to consider. https://www.roadtechmarine.com.au/rapid-bar-600-weight-distribution-kit-275kg-ball-capacity/p/RTE042


Personally, I wouldn't run air bags on a leaf spring rear end. If over inflated they can bend chassis when towing as where they're placed is not meant to carry load. Where the springs are bolted is where the load should be. When you raised the rear did they add a leaf for extra load? In my Triton, when I replaced the rear springs, it was only raised 25mm. I replaced them more for the extra load I was carrying (canopy, fridge, dual battery as well as either boat or van). I had a leaf added so there was less flex in the springs when empty but when loaded there was little drop and the car handled a lot better. With the upgraded springs and an old HR WDH on the Heritage (roughly 1,900kg loaded) it towed beautifully. Not exactly the same as your 2.2T @Lozza T, but in the ball park.

Never towed the expanda with the Triton, had too many problems with it so sold it before upgrading the van.

Thanks @The escapist
The RTM option does seem good and I do like the price. Is the tow hitch adjustable? I will need to raise my tow ball height at least 100mm.

I had the full suspension done so all my springs front and back were replaced and new foam cell shocks.

 

[MickL]

Eaz lift https://www.caravansplus.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=10958 is another brand that I have heard good reviews on and is cheaper than a HR. As other have said, I wouldn't even consider airbags for a triton as there are too many stories of people bending chassis with them. Triton Bum is too big and overhang is too long!

 

[Drover]

So there you go @Lozza T , question answered and more.................in a nutshell sell the Triton and get a Holden, lol,lol,lol..........

Next tip, when you hook up make sure the Breakaway cable is not hanging down and has room to stretch, if low a stick, dead roo, bit of rubber can dislodge it and you will quickly find how good the van brakes are........

 

[Lozza T]

Thanks @Drover
Would love to upgrade the tow vehicle but might be a few years away yet. (need to convince the business partner first...)
The Ford Ranger was on my future wish list, should I consider the Colorado? The new Hilux looks alright too.
Thanks also re the tip on the breakaway cable!

 

[EDT82]

Triton Bum is too big and overhang is too long![/QUOTE]
On that I remember a little of theory from may tafe days on fulcrum points. So if you put 100kg directly on rear axle it's worth 100kg. For every 1m away from axle fulcrum is created and worth another 100kg. So saying putting the same 100kg 1m away from axle is worth double the down force (200kg) 2m away (400kgs). Creating lift in front of axle That's probably not exact but there is calcs we did do at trade tafe a loooong time ago. Lol

 

[MickL]

I think what a lot of people forget or don't realize is that by placing weight on the rear of the car your taking it off the front which in turn effects your braking, steering etc etc. The WDH is more about getting that weight back onto the front of the car which in turn helps with sway etc. You also get the bonus of having an adjustable hitch so can get your rig/van level which further helps.

 

[Drover]

I have wondered about pushing the rear axle to the rear an extra foot but probably be cheaper to just go and buy an Effie....

I found out about the breakaway the hard way but thankfully it was a branch in a van park on the road so wasn't going fast..........

Colorado, Ranger, Mazda or Izuzu all pretty much same, same........Hi Lux is getting there but way overpriced.........

I've looked at my bull bar and wondered if I could make a water tank to fit, extra bit of weight (and slosh).

 

[Dobbie]

Or some other liquid?

I once investigated getting my empty jerry cans filled with bulk port when down south. Thought it was a perfect solution to replenish supplies and an easy way to transport it as they were fitted to the old camper trailer.

I was strongly discouraged but I was going to clean them out. The port would have been fully matured by now ...opportunity missed but poisoning averted.

 

[Drover]

Nice idea @Dobbie, once upon a time when I was required to change my blue ensemble and wear Green, we had RUM in those 20lt plastic Jerry Cans they had a black stripe so we didn't get them mixed up with the water and do us some damage..........nearly 40 yrs ago and it is one of my wishes to have a couple again..........the CSM would let us have half a tin cup each evening, oh joy.........

 

[The escapist]

@Lozza T , yep the hitch from RTM adjusts up ok. On my car (Coloado 7) it's too high! I'm fitting a spacer to the hitch on the van to lower the draw bar as I can't lower the hitch any more.