ALKO - ESC saved our life

CJ1177

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Jan 28, 2013
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On the weekend just past, we were heading north for a short trip away, when all I can say in short is " I'm so glad I had the ALKO -ESC retro fitted onto our van, & I can't speak high enough of it & how it performed.

The story goes, we were traveling behind a semi trailer at approximately 100kph when he merged into a turning lane to turn into a side road, a head of him turning right out of the same road was a new blue FJ cruiser.

He subsequently pulled out in front of me:eek-53:, first reaction was to hit the breaks & horn, I realised both I wouldn't stop in time nor would he be out of the way in time if I kept my current line, so I swung it to the left thinking he would keep rolling through the intersection & I could slip around the back of him.

Then OMG :eek-53::eek-53: He stopped right there across the middle of a dual lane HWY in a 100kph zone, & I quickly realised that escape route I was heading for was no longer, so I swung the Pathfinder hard to the right with out any care for the van hanging off the back & just hoped that there were no cars beside me & back again to correct it.

During these fleeting moments all I remember was the sound of screeching tyres & the sensation of the ESC pulling on the car hard, then as I accelerated out of there the next thing was the ESC was still active ensuring the swing was finished before releasing & looking back in the mirror to see the intersection filled with blue smoke.

That was the scariest moment I think I have ever had, and I have no doubt with out the combination of ABS in the car & more so the ESC on the van to keep it straight, things would have been much worse for not only our car but for the Toyota I was trying to avoid.

We pulled over just down the road & gave the wife a hug who was shaking & just starting to cry, checked on the boys in the back seat, got out walked around the van to check that it was all still intact & the interior was the way we left it, thankfully everything was all good so we continued on our way.

The funny thing was the first thing I said to her was "are you still cranky I brought the ESC" because at the time I got it fitted she complained that it was a huge waste of money & could be better spent on other things.

She just smiled at me.

If you were uming & areing trying to decide is it worth the money...... Let me say it is worth every cent then some & your a bloody idiot if you don't, not to mention a tight arse for spending +40k on the van & not purchase such a simple safety device.

Chris
 
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17triton

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Feb 24, 2013
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Wow !!! Great to hear you and the family are ok. Near misses always put the sh#ts up ya . Great outcome and thanks for sharing.
 
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Kenshi123

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Wow. Moments like this sure do put the important things into perspective. Glad you are ok. Did you buy a lottery ticket???
 
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macca

(aka maccayak)
Mar 20, 2012
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Thanks Chris for sharing that with us. I must admit I have not thought that much about the Alko Esc, so its good to hear your experience with it (in a good way I mean). How much does it add to the cost of a van? I noted the little Starcraft next to me a couple of weeks ago had it. It is something I will definitely think about in future as as always we are thinking of upgrading next year, but if as normal we keep our van I will look at the retro fit option.
 
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Ligedy

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Oct 13, 2012
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If you were uming & areing trying to decide is it worth the money...... Let me say it is worth every cent then some & your a bloody idiot if you don't, not to mention a tight arse for spending +40k on the van & not purchase such a simple safety device.

Chris

Glad you and your family made it out of that one Chris. Thanks for sharing - Even the thought of ‘what if’ it went the other way after reading your post puts the wind up me as I have the wifey and two boys and know that feeling when things are way too close for comfort. And you’re right – controlling the van on the back is the last thing on your mind when the situation changes in an instant.

I'll admit I’m in the bloody idiot category – I drive in /drive out for work 1100km a week and see crazy $hit on the roads all the time, the same roads I drive on for holidays when towing the van… I’ve even posted on another thread about how ESC must be a good safety device considering money spent on a new van... since then I've spent countless $'s on inverters, coffee machines, tool boxes and bling gear... yet still put ESC at the bottom of the list in lieu of some other purchase.

Well not today – I’m biting the bullet after reading your post and can’t stop thinking of my family this xmas caravanning trip – instead of buying the inverter genset I’ll be booking the panda into have ESC installed as soon as they open up shop this morning.

Cheers Ligedy
 

blacky

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Sep 17, 2013
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Good onya for the share mate, and good on @Ligedy for the action.. I'll be keen to see the outcome of your retrofit and maybe a rough idea of how much it set you back.. obviously will be money well spent!
 
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Walks

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Sep 15, 2013
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The funny thing was the first thing I said to her was "are you still cranky I brought the ESC" because at the time I got it fitted she complained that it was a huge waste of money & could be better spent on other things.

Glad everyones safe and you all escaped with just a fright. How much did the ESC set you back?
 
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Ligedy

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Oct 13, 2012
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I rang three places in QLD (all north of BNE) all quoted $1295 for the retrofit.

Seems to be set by ALKO as only approved installers can sell and install it.

About one week for the supply of the customized module and a few hours to fit.

I was told new Jaycos now come prewired for it.

All three places had different comments on power supply req's...

1) dedicated power feed from battery (no exceptions if an Anderson plug is already there - must be standalone run).

2) piggy back a second anderson plug off the existing anderson plug power supply

3) run it off pin two off the trailer plug and existing earth.

Anyway - on 9th December it will be installed and ready to roll.
 
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CJ1177

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Thanks Guys,
I think the guy in the FJ cruiser would have had bigger brown stains than I, having a 4WD & trailer combo heading straight for his door feeling like a sitting duck.

Cost wise from memory was about $1200-$1300, I too rang around all of the local people who are authorised to install to get there price, thoughts & instal procedure etc, they were very adamant on it having it's own power supply from the car, with one even suggesting a second anderson plug.
In the end I got Jayco to do it, & they tapped into the factory hot wire (pin 2) that charges the battery, & he wasn't to concerned about the Anderson being under the same CB & isolation relay.

Good call @Ligedy, hopefully you wont have to try it out first hand like I did
 

jeff

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Mar 4, 2013
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We had it retro fitted to our van some time ago, all up $1400. I think I may have felt it kick in once on a gravel road when I took a corner to fast. Have felt safer travelling since we had it fitted
 
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millers

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Mar 25, 2011
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Chris,

Good to hear everyone made it through this with only stains to the rear of their pants. Also good that the car and van are not damaged. You may want to think about having the tyres on the van checked (re-balanced) just in case you have flat spotted one or both of them.

Cheers Steve
 
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Ligedy

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Oct 13, 2012
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Anyone got feedback of ESC and off road touring with the van hooked up?

I’m getting ESC fitted next week and I see AKLO mentions for ‘serious’ off road driving it can inadvertently activate the brakes - so a separate 2-pin power supply (Anderson plug) or switched power arrangement is recommended so it can be disconnected…

I’m not planning on any ‘serious’ off road driving but don’t want the ESC to be kicking in when travelling the back tracks looking for a good camp site (I also couldn’t be arsed running more wires on my tow rig).
 
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Soaring

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Jan 30, 2013
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Sorry guys. A couple of things with van ESC do not sit right with me.
Let me say at the outset that I have been involved with ABS and ESC calibration for many years in the past.
Traditional or modern ESC that most of us are familiar with take inputs from various sensors mounted in the vehicle. These measure things like acceleration, deceleration, yaw rate, steering wheel input, wheel rotation, throttle position to name a few.
These inputs are then run through the ECU which determined the appropriate individual wheel braking and engine power cutoffs required to maximise stability and ensure the vehicle responds to the intended driver inputs.
To get this right takes literally thousands of hours by very experienced engineers, with horrendously expensive test equipment and mule vehicles.

What does that Alko ESC system use as inputs, and what ability does it have to affect the output?
Inputs are driver brake actuation, perhaps a yaw sensor, but that's it. It does not " know" where you want to go, it does not know if you have locked up your brakes.
The output of the system is to actuate the brakes. Note, the brakes are not able to be actuated individually either, like in a car ESC. It's an on or off proposition only.
Essentially it's doing the same as hitting your brake over-ride lever on you break controller when the yaw sensor detects excessive sideways movement.
Granted this is a useful function on certain circumstances such as excessive sway or a classic swerve manoeuvre, but no more effective that hitting your over- ride.
In a hard breaking situation like described above, it has very limited ability to affect the outcome, as the brakes have already been actuated. If you have a proportional controller, your brakes are already at maximum voltage when emergency braking. As mentioned above, there is no wheel speed sensors, so the Alko system does not even know if you are locked up! It's a "dumb" system without a feedback loop.
Also keep in mind that this system supposably can be retro fitted to your caravan by the same guys that struggle to operate a silicone or grease gun.....Really??

The reason for the explanation above is not to turn anyone off the system. Any additional safety features are a good thing, and I see that there is a place forCaravan ESC, But I want to clarify the limitations, and expectations of this.
Just like with the introduction of ABS on cars, this drove a level of driver complacency that actually resulted in increased vehicle accidents.
This has been an area I've worked in off many years and have a passion for, so I'm just trying to ensure that marketing does not override reality.
 
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blacky

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Thanks @Soaring great explaination mate. So what we need is a full ABS system on our vans that can communicate with the ECU on the tug.. Now THAT would be good!
 

CJ1177

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Thanks @Soaring , I absolutely agree & pretty much formed the same opinion as you before getting mine retro fitted, I agree it's not much different to hitting the emergency button, But I can tell you during the emergency avoidance there was no way I was taking my hand off the steering wheel to press no button.
I can definitely remember the sensation of the the ESC coming on & pulling harder against the tug, then staying on for a few seconds after I straightened up, for what I imagine is to prevent any further sway.

I only have a static brake controler & even if I had pressed the emergency button, it won't apply any more volts than the foot, whereas the ESC applies 40% volts, & I would be doubtful if my controler passes that many volts through normally, I know with my van it will lock up if too much volts are applied to the brakes.

I have now been in two situations where I have had a major sway in the trailer, the first time without any assistance & after seeing the promotional material for the ESC I thought I had to have that because I never want to go through that again, then low & behold I did. But thankfully I had the ESC fitted, cause I'm sure it would have ended a whole lot different than it did without it.

As for settings from memory they needed the wheel size, brakes size, length of the van & taree weight & height, they were ok if i wanted to raise it a little, but would need recalibration if i changed the wheel size.

I had a giggle at your last comment about trusting them to retrofit this system when they struggle with a silicone gun, at least it's all pre-set & all they have to do is screw it to the floor & connect a couple of wires & in my case it's done by a contractor for Jayco.
 
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