Solar Solar Charging in 20.6 Expanda Caravan

[Wombat6]

So almost 2 months ago we picked up a new 20.6 Expanda caravan - we love it. We have taken it on three short trips and I am still getting my head around charging the onboard batteries (two). I got them to install an Anderson plug to plug in an external solar panel I have in addition to the rook panel. However, I don't seem to be getting the results I would expect. Last weekend after two rainy days we were down to almost no battery power. However, whilst the roof panel was in shade much of the day, I kept the 160W external panel largely in sun but the batteries according to the Drifter panel did not indicate any change. Any thoughts?

I had previously talked to the Bayswater Jayco service centre who explained the solar controller above the fridge which showed some charge but rarely more than 1 amp through the day. Would they have connected the external plug directly to the batteries (will try and call them to find out)? Another question I have is does the solar controller go directly to the batteries or through the Drifter control panel?

Final question is that even with two batteries (can't remember if they are 100 or 120 A/H) we still go through them in around two days. Now we are not very conservative with power: use the water pumps a lot, light up the caravan like a Christmas tree at night, charge lots of electronic equipment, etc but is this also other people's experience?

Lots of questions I know i will get the answers to eventually except that next week we are going away on a three week trip where half the time we will be in remote areas and I don't want to have to connect up the car every couple of days to charge up the batteries.

Thanks for any advice on these questions.

 

[Crusty181]

HI @Wombat6 I have a 2014 20.6 with a 150w roof panel, portable panel and 2 x 120ah batteries.

Solar controller should be wired direct through to the battery, via the Drifters "shunt" that will be likely be on top of your battery.

I rarely use the portable panel for the van, generally its connected to the car for the Engel. Our 150w van panel peaks out at around 7amps in full sun, and plummets with anything more than a hand print of shadow. We had major charging issues initially because the Wombats (excuse the reference) at Jayco completely buggered up the solar wiring. They went to extraordinary lengths and made the wiring incredibly neat .... but wrong

Once I rewired it, its pretty good but we've been up north. Back home with our pox sunshine we will stuggle. Without full sun on the panel we would start to struggle after maybe 3 days, the cycling water pump is a give away for us that the batteries are running down.

Once the batteries are charged the solar regulator and drifter will indicate no (or a small) input charge simply because once charged, there's no power going into the batteries. If your vans sitting in the back yard in full sun with nothing drawing on the batteries, the solar regulator will show very little charge because the batteries are full.

We have no option but to curb our power consumption if its overcast, and in shadow with a similar set up to you. The roof panel in perfect condition's generates 7amps for maybe 4 or 5 hours ie 35amps per day in perfect condition's. Our satellite TV, stereo, fans, water pump, phones, tablets, cameras all charging will add up to way more than 35amps over a day. One double ceiling LED light is around 4amps from memory, so 3 or 4 of them left on adds up.

We're in Mentone, where in Melb are you.

 

[Wombat6]

Crusty181,

Sounds like we have the same configuration. Today with the van in full sun (although the solar panel was at an oblique angle) and just the roof top panel the solar controller was showing around 5 amps so at least it looks like it is doing something. However, when later plugged in the portable panel, initially there was no change and after I unplugged it and then plugged it back in the controller then showed 0 amps which I don't understand (although earlier I had pluged in the mains power and maybe from what you say the batteries were charged by then).

I'm going to give Bayswater Jayco a call tomorrow and see what they say because if we have to camp under trees then I will need the portable panel to charge the batteries. I did read somewhere else that there were issues with the onboard controllers on the cheaper portable panels so I don't know whether Bayswater Jayco wired the external plug directly into the batteries or through the controller but if the later then maybe I should just bypass the controller on the panel. Another question for them.

Anyway, we live in Mount Waverley. Thanks for all your great information. Not that important when staying in caravan parks but half our trip will be in National Parks so I do want to have some understanding of the set up.

 

[Dobbie]

Only thoughts I had....(and we do a lot of off grid camping)

You say that the external panel is wired to the battery. Directly? If so you need a separate regulator for that. Can't see if you have that. I'd add a simple voltmeter to that to see if it's actually doing what it should. EBay ....look for voltmeter, add Anderson plug to both ends and connect it to test.

It might be worth using one of the solar use / battery use spreadsheets available online to actually determine where your problem lies....if you can't find one, I'll try to find a link to one. It's amazing what you can be careful with if you're aware of what really drains the batteries.

Our 150 w panel with one battery....and almost obsessive monitoring ....used to give us up to three weeks off grid ....and that was with pump, lights, TVs, Chargers etc etc. I posted a report on this site about a year ago.

 

[Crusty181]

If so you need a separate regulator for that

Separate solar regulators to the same battery will play funny buggers with each other.

 

[MDS69]

Also when setting up portable solar kits you should lay them face down on the ground, plug them in or however you connect to your battery then turn the panel over to face the sun.

 

[Crusty181]

Also when setting up portable solar kits you should lay them face down on the ground, plug them in or however you connect to your battery then turn the panel over to face the sun.

Ive not heard that, what's the thinking behind it @MDS69

 

[Drover]

Have had no problems with portable panel with its own controller in direct connection with battery while roof top unit cherging thru its own system, but then if it was wired by Jayco ?
I have fitted a direct run from battery to an Anderson on chassis, fuzed and I can plug in a panel or just use it as a power socket.

 

[Dobbie]

I also have to say we've never had a problem.

Roof solar was Jayco wired to controller in the van; portable solar was via draw bar Anderson wired directly to the battery (with the separate controller also with andersons ) and the system could input from either.

Absolutely no conflict with the separate controllers...both protected with blocking diodes.

and I never worried about the roof solar being in shade as the portable could provide enough to keep the batteries fully charged.

As said, when free camping it's obviously a combination of monitoring input and reducing output within reason if you want to last more than a few days.

 

[Dobbie]

Ive not heard that, what's the thinking behind it @MDS69

I'm assuming that's because the portable solar should be connected first to the load...the battery...then to the solar ..for best results. Turning over the panel just does that if both are connected.

I've noticed, when I have the voltmeter attached to the portable, I can't get a reading unless I connect the solar input after connecting to the battery.

 

[Crusty181]

Have had no problems with portable panel with its own controller in direct connection with battery while roof top unit cherging thru its own system, but then if it was wired by Jayco ?
I have fitted a direct run from battery to an Anderson on chassis, fuzed and I can plug in a panel or just use it as a power socket.

Just throwing it out there, I thought that without some kind of blocking system, one regulator producing full charge into the battery would trick the other regulator into thinking the battery i full and shut down the charge ... and visa versa ... forever. It will still work, but not fully as per the 2 panels. Maybe we need to experts to jump in here would be good to know

 

[Dobbie]

Yep. Interesting as I thought this was one thing I'd really sorted out!

My understanding is that the onboard solar, wired to the battery is a stand alone unit with all the load and monitoring via the drifter or whatever.

The extra portable can't be wired to that as it has to bypass or ignore it so has to be directly wired to the battery.
Hence, it needs its own regulator and the battery sees it as a totally separate input.

With the blocking diodes in both, each regulator is isolated from the other so each operate according to how much solar ia available....both contributing to the charge.

at least, that's my understanding of it.

 

[Drover]

All covered somewhere but I will say the blocking diodes are on your panels themselves between panel and regulator but my system works well with separate regulatirs.

 

[MDS69]

Ive not heard that, what's the thinking behind it

[QUOTE="Dobbie, post: 168093, member: 4031"]I'm assuming that's because the portable solar should be connected first to the load...the battery...then to the solar ..for best results. Turning over the panel just does that if both are connected.

I've noticed, when I have the voltmeter attached to the portable, I can't get a reading unless I connect the solar input after connecting to the battery.[/QUOTE]

What @Dobbie said. A few of the solar gurus on Myswag recommend it and I always use that sequence when connecting my portable set up when I had the soft floor after I had an issue of not working which I put down to exposing the panels to the sun before connecting to the load. I think it is more to do with the panel mounted regulator than the regulator being mounted close to the battery. The regulator senses a voltage from the load and does it black magic but if it was to receive voltage from the input ie panels then some other black magic happens and won't work. (black magic in a technical term;))

 

[Drover]

Just throwing it out there, I thought that without some kind of blocking system, one regulator producing full charge into the battery would trick the other regulator into thinking the battery i full and shut down the charge ... and visa versa ... forever. It will still work, but not fully as per the 2 panels. Maybe we need to experts to jump in here would be good to know

It's just the same as if you have your 240v charger running at the same time as your solar is working, they shouldn't conflict...................I know this as I asked the question elsewhere on here ages back and a knowledgable member informed me, and since nothing has blown up, melted or sizzled , he was correct.

 

[Dobbie]

Soooooo.....we're in agreement?

If so, I won't have to change the set up on the new van. It worked beautifully on the expanda.

I hate second guessing myself!

It's all @Crusty181 's fault!!

 

[Drover]

Soooooo.....we're in agreement?

If so, I won't have to change the set up on the new van. It worked beautifully on the expanda.

I hate second guessing myself!

It's all @Crusty181 's fault!!

We will be so glad when your new rig turns up, what hospital do we send the get well cards to ??? You will surely be in shock if everything on it works properly...................lol,lol your such a worry puss @Dobbie

 

[Macca_75]

for what it's worth we recently went away on our maiden voyage and I started reading the manuals and playing with buttons

I notice the regulator did not have the wiring installed for the "load indicator".

At some stages we were putting 3+ Amps back into the batteries (according to the panel above the fridge) - camped under a tree.

When there is no draw from the van the Drifta indicated the same figure as the regulator (but the approximate run time left was absent) which left me to guess this means an overall surplus going back into the batteries. When I switched appliances on the Drifra seemed to indicate the surplus still going into the batteries.

When I go in for the first service I will ask why the load button is not wired up and for them to correct it - it would be nice to know what load is leaving the batteries (the function is there - they just didn't run the wires).

I am yet to try the anderson I had Bayswater wire up (similar to what you have done).

 

[Dobbie]

Only because I'm sick of cleaning out the shed!

Now about 80pc done and about 27 trailer loads to the dump.....how is it possible to accumulate so much crap over the years?

All the stuff that we've kept "in case we might need it" is no more.

Space is wonderful....it's the final bit that challenging me.

Anyone want an unused front bumper from a 1995 Pajero ?
or an auto tiller for a yacht?
or a metho stove on a gimbal?
or four coffee machines?
or thirty eight recipe books for stuff we used to like
or two jockey wheels


None of them working but now on the trailer.

The three old mowers are being checked in case there's some sign of life and, if dead, guess where they're going.

I know a garage sale could have been possible but by the time we'd organised it I'd have lost the incentive.

No wonder I've been worrying about solar setups.

Oh damn....I suspect this is another digression.

 

[Drover]

Most units will have the load not going anywhere, it is basically for running stuff straight off the panels, regulated output of course...It is far better to run everything via the batteries that way all panel power goes to batteries and you get your feed from it/them.