Over-loaded tug and/or Van!! Is this you???

Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
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Ferny Grove, Queensland
#1
Recently I enjoyed the company of @wally of "Weight Check" at the Dicky Beach Caravan Park. In the general conversation, he mentioned that tug and van weights are the talk of a lot of forums and Facebook. The reason - he mentioned that a driver in NSW was up on several charges including two deaths because his van /tug combo was overloaded, causing an accident, and he will probably be facing jail time as well. Nothing more was brought up at the time and I had nearly forgotten about it when @Drover provided a link for another Member regarding power etc to break away battery for van. Lo and Behold, on the same link to RV Daily, (a popular touring Magazine) is the story of what happened and what the driver is facing as a result of several charges. The magazine Editors cannot provide full details as yet as the matter is to go before the courts, but vanners in NSW and VIC are already worried as to what will come out of this court decision. Not only did the accident kill his Wife and Son, which he now has to live with, and not to mention the financial losses (no insurance?) and legal fees he will face, but some are saying he will also be looking at time in the clink!! And he was a truck driver too!!
There is a very important paragraph about what a 3.5t towing capacity really means, something @Drover has been "barking on about" for some time (woof woof!). What GVM is, what ATM is and what GCM really means.
All members, particularly those with large heavy vans, should make sure they read the full story "Shock News _ tragedy leads to prosecution for over-weight caravan". ) The punch line is "Is the complacency about what your car and caravan actually weigh over?" As the Driver is SOLELY RESPONSIBLE if the vehicle/van are involved in an accident, one needs to think about the consequences especially in NSW, and probably Victoria and other states too as Police and Transport Department Authorities take a harder line on vans and tugs. It is a very sobering thought when you understand what could happen and the chances you are taking. Tread your own path on this!!!!

https://magazine.rvdaily.com.au/en_US/14233/201856/downloadable_pdf_tiles.html the link is where you can download the issue .........
 

Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
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Mentone, VIC
#3
There wouldn't be a single Jayco on the road even with the bare minimum of gear in it that inst over weight if the water tanks are full.
Weighed our van today at Trafalgar on the way home from NSW, 60kg over with full tanks ... ill take that. When we ordered the van we had the ATM lowered to match the previous cars 3t capacity, so i satisfied im actually under the original factory weight
 
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Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
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Mentone, VIC
#4
Unless i load the roof rack of the Troopy with courtyard pavers, and bags of cement im pretty confident any road block weigh-in will be just an opportunity to stretch my legs, grab a coffee and enjoy the show
 

BJM

Active Member
Sep 29, 2018
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Yamba
#6
Six weeks around Qld in the last month only confirmed my belief the number of overweight vans and tow vehicle combinations are increasing..Add in caravan manufacturers deliberately fudging van weights,RV mags telling owners to add more and more accessories ,vehicle manufacturers /dealers not being honest re tow capacities ,owners who are totally ignorant/arrogant of their legal requirements re towing caravans and its know wonder there has been a huge increase in accidents.My van insurance has increased a lot ,NRMAs telling me more accidents in the Nthn NSW area (and increase in hail claims )I am paying for the idiots.PS I have a good mate who falls into the she’ll be right category and knows full well he is well overweight.
 

Drover

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Nov 7, 2013
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Cooloola Coast, QLD
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#7
Nothing new there, they drive past my place all the time ................. a good look at single vehicles heading to the beach can be scary as well, lots of bums dragging on ground................ Hate to say but my Insurance has dropped for both Tug and Van, maybe its time for a change of insurer ??
 

Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
869
792
93
Ferny Grove, Queensland
#8
Six weeks around Qld in the last month only confirmed my belief the number of overweight vans and tow vehicle combinations are increasing..Add in caravan manufacturers deliberately fudging van weights,RV mags telling owners to add more and more accessories ,vehicle manufacturers /dealers not being honest re tow capacities ,owners who are totally ignorant/arrogant of their legal requirements re towing caravans and its know wonder there has been a huge increase in accidents.My van insurance has increased a lot ,NRMAs telling me more accidents in the Nthn NSW area (and increase in hail claims )I am paying for the idiots.PS I have a good mate who falls into the she’ll be right category and knows full well he is well overweight.
Totally ignorant or arrogant is a good description unfortunately @BJM . I spent quite a time reading through the complete RV Daily link on all the related subjects too, and sadly the danger of unsafe overloading and weight distribution is not getting through to most people. It probably won't either, until personal tragedy or financial loss occurs, or tougher legislation is brought in and enforced properly. How, I don't know!! But if responsibility is initially thrown back onto the van manufacturers and RV dealers who fit the extra accessories before meeting the desires of the van/tug owner, that would be a start. After that, it becomes the responsibility of the DRIVER. Although all the GVMs, ATMs and CGMs are clearly set out on compliance plates, it appears that they are being deliberately ignored by some who should know better, or for the uneducated, are a meaningless set of numbers.
 
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Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
5,291
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Mentone, VIC
#9
Caravan accidents are a very small percentage of overall road carnage and are the stats within the sector are still a minor percentage. The auto and caravan sales industries are both commission-based and cutthroat. Love em or hate them they all have families and lives, are just doing a job, are doing nothing illegal and their own survival hinges on the vested interests of getting their hand in your wallet, and its not his job to hold your hand or assume your responsibilities; why should he care what car you drive .... your an adult. Its not the car sales guys responsibility to deep dive into your lifestyle and precisely what you intend to do with this proposed new car ... and then what?, refuse to sell it to you if he doesnt lke the answers?. With weights and overloading, the buck stops with the individual. Its no more the manufacturer or agents problem with cars and vans than the Big W checkout chick that sells the toaster today to the idiot that jambs the knife it in tomorrow. We already have way too much offset of responsibility in our society, without creating yet another ready-made excuse machine. Our culture just has a big issue with authority, rules and responsibilities, and we as a whole we will ignore everything that doesnt suit us and then scream like Facebook blocked school girls when we're held accountable. We have a large chip, and an even bigger hand out mentality. If we aren't physically or financially forced to comply with anything .... we will simply ignore it. I suspect you'll get your wish. With all the relentless jibber jabber about overloading on social media and the adulation and Mexicans waves when there is a roadblock weight check or someone gets caught, its only a matter of time before some pi$$ant bureaucrat joins the dots, the light bulb goes on, and they see the massive untapped overweight fine revenue stream. They already have the heavy vehicle infrastructure in place in order to weigh the vans, the vanning community will initially just blindly applaud the crackdown, the fines will be thrown around like confetti ... and by the time the vanning community discovers its going to bite pretty hard, it will too late.

At least that's what I'd be doing if I was was a bureaucrat looking for a promotion ... cha - ching !!!!
 

Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
869
792
93
Ferny Grove, Queensland
#10
Caravan accidents are a very small percentage of overall road carnage and are the stats within the sector are still a minor percentage. The auto and caravan sales industries are both commission-based and cutthroat. Love em or hate them they all have families and lives, are just doing a job, are doing nothing illegal and their own survival hinges on the vested interests of getting their hand in your wallet, and its not his job to hold your hand or assume your responsibilities; why should he care what car you drive .... your an adult. Its not the car sales guys responsibility to deep dive into your lifestyle and precisely what you intend to do with this proposed new car ... and then what?, refuse to sell it to you if he doesnt lke the answers?. With weights and overloading, the buck stops with the individual. Its no more the manufacturer or agents problem with cars and vans than the Big W checkout chick that sells the toaster today to the idiot that jambs the knife it in tomorrow. We already have way too much offset of responsibility in our society, without creating yet another ready-made excuse machine. Our culture just has a big issue with authority, rules and responsibilities, and we as a whole we will ignore everything that doesnt suit us and then scream like Facebook blocked school girls when we're held accountable. We have a large chip, and an even bigger hand out mentality. If we aren't physically or financially forced to comply with anything .... we will simply ignore it. I suspect you'll get your wish. With all the relentless jibber jabber about overloading on social media and the adulation and Mexicans waves when there is a roadblock weight check or someone gets caught, its only a matter of time before some pi$$ant bureaucrat joins the dots, the light bulb goes on, and they see the massive untapped overweight fine revenue stream. They already have the heavy vehicle infrastructure in place in order to weigh the vans, the vanning community will initially just blindly applaud the crackdown, the fines will be thrown around like confetti ... and by the time the vanning community discovers its going to bite pretty hard, it will too late.

At least that's what I'd be doing if I was was a bureaucrat looking for a promotion ... cha - ching !!!!
@Crusty181 , I like your thinking and it is so true. Unfortunately, all rules are set to cover the lowest common denominator - the bloody idiots and those that don't want to comply for the good of all! And the responsible and safety thinking types (like you and me!) pay the price in more restrictions. That is the world we live in!! Sigh.
 
Likes: BJM

Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
5,291
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Mentone, VIC
#11
Great to be so confident @Crusty181! Some others are looking a bit worried.
I want to be properly set up Boots.




(By set up, I mean when @Bluey gets directed into the weighbridge on his way to Forster at Xmas time, I want to have the best vantage point, the deck chairs positioned correctly with some dips and crackers and also be close enough to hear the chit chat :cheer2:)
 

Bluey

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Mar 31, 2014
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victoria
#12
Well yes and no @Crusty181 i stated many many times to jayco i only have a prado this van the 1756-2 outback seems a bit heavy for me .... no sir we will change the plate and its not too heavy anyway no dramas well long storie short i drove out from jayco overloaded with empty van brand new
Salesmen companys van makers do have a lot to answer for evan car salesmen not explaining to the peanuts what they can and carnt do if they dont know isnt it there job to imform on there product mmmmmmm Jayco screwed me very well and hard would have been nice to take me out to diner before going straight for the wedding night
 

Bluey

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Mar 31, 2014
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victoria
#13
I want to be properly set up Boots.




(By set up, I mean when @Bluey gets directed into the weighbridge on his way to Forster at Xmas time, I want to have the best vantage point, the deck chairs positioned correctly with some dips and crackers and also be close enough to hear the chit chat :cheer2:)
I dont like that at all seens i carnt belt the cops dont be too close on that day well my now 200 is a better option for towing expect a phone call lol lol
 

Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
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Mentone, VIC
#14
@Crusty181 , I like your thinking and it is so true. Unfortunately, all rules are set to cover the lowest common denominator - the bloody idiots and those that don't want to comply for the good of all! And the responsible and safety thinking types (like you and me!) pay the price in more restrictions. That is the world we live in!! Sigh.
I hear you Boots but .... and a big but, rules don't really cut it in good olde Straya and never really have. I learnt a long time ago as a kid, and it was later reinforced with my own kids if there aren't any genuine and tangible consequences for EVERY questionable action, the rules meant diddly squat. Not sure why a donkey chippy from the burbs of Melb can see that, but the kings and kingmakers cant. Personally, I'm in favour of smashing everyone mercilessly who steps too far from centre, and using very real consequences to mount a broadside on this cultural "she'll be right mate" bull$hit attitude. If you choose to govern, govern; if you chose to police, then police; if you chose to make rules, then enforce them with a firm hand, else let the hordes fight it out amongst themselves.
 

Drover

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Nov 7, 2013
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Cooloola Coast, QLD
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#15
They brought in Fatigue Management and other political BS for heavy vehicles along with Chain of responsibility so when the driver gets done for overweight/accident etc it is supposed to swing back to the blokes that loaded the vehicle/ supervisors/managers etc so the pain is shared especially as often the driver has nothing to do with loading and more than likely is 1,00kmk away having a zooz, it's great in theory but didn't seem to do much up till I left the industry and I doubt it has done much since, the same with this van loading problem, has always been there and sadly won't change overnight no matter how much the Social Media Guardians of the World bleat away, the magazines rabbit on about things, usually lacking substance and any actual information to educate people other than little sound bites which are useless, a full blown course on weights would need a couple of days so people can get their heads around it all but since my last dangerous goods course was only a day long maybe a half day course................more inspectors would be needed of course, equipment and like drink driving they would always have jobs.
 

Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
869
792
93
Ferny Grove, Queensland
#16
I want to be properly set up Boots.




(By set up, I mean when @Bluey gets directed into the weighbridge on his way to Forster at Xmas time, I want to have the best vantage point, the deck chairs positioned correctly with some dips and crackers and also be close enough to hear the chit chat :cheer2:)
That's a bit harsh @Crusty181 , wanting to watch a so called friend's demise as he is directed to unload excess load, drain water and grey water tanks and leave behind any assorted items at the side of the road at the check point. I have seen this on the Pacific Highway a while back when travelling from Brisbane to Nowra.
Be a "real" friend and warn him of his errors before he leaves for Foster.
 
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Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
869
792
93
Ferny Grove, Queensland
#17
They brought in Fatigue Management and other political BS for heavy vehicles along with Chain of responsibility so when the driver gets done for overweight/accident etc it is supposed to swing back to the blokes that loaded the vehicle/ supervisors/managers etc so the pain is shared especially as often the driver has nothing to do with loading and more than likely is 1,00kmk away having a zooz, it's great in theory but didn't seem to do much up till I left the industry and I doubt it has done much since, the same with this van loading problem, has always been there and sadly won't change overnight no matter how much the Social Media Guardians of the World bleat away, the magazines rabbit on about things, usually lacking substance and any actual information to educate people other than little sound bites which are useless, a full blown course on weights would need a couple of days so people can get their heads around it all but since my last dangerous goods course was only a day long maybe a half day course................more inspectors would be needed of course, equipment and like drink driving they would always have jobs.
The best that one could hope for would be random checks and everyone drives through this gauntlet, just like RBT checks. I agree that any law is a bad law if it is NOT enforced. Just a waste of legislation and jobs for the paper pushers otherwise.
 
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Crusty181

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Feb 7, 2010
5,291
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Mentone, VIC
#18
That's a bit harsh @Crusty181 , wanting to watch a so called friend's demise as he is directed to unload excess load, drain water and grey water tanks and leave behind any assorted items at the side of the road at the check point. I have seen this on the Pacific Highway a while back when travelling from Brisbane to Nowra.
Be a "real" friend and warn him of his errors before he leaves for Foster.
Or ..... collect what he leaves behind, load it into the voluminous and payload rich Troopy, follow him to Forster and sell it back to him.
 

BJM

Active Member
Sep 29, 2018
121
137
43
Yamba
#19
And the 50 kilo dog My mate has ! His wife would be unloaded first in any weight check before the dog.The problem with this debate education is not working .
 
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